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field torn up

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Efulmer - 16 May 2004 22:42 GMT
Well it's getting regular that someone is cutting circles in our field with
those darn 4 wheel drive trucks.  Have any of you guys had any experience with
that at your fields and what did you do to combat it?  Eddie Fulmer Pres. West
Alabama Aero Modelers...
Paul McIntosh - 16 May 2004 23:15 GMT
West Alabama?  Good luck!

We had that problem once.  They would come at night and do burnouts on the
runway.  Have you ever seen the tack strips the police use?  They work!  A
couple in the longer grass at the approaches to the runway did the trick.

--
Paul McIntosh
http://www.rc-bearings.com
> Well it's getting regular that someone is cutting circles in our field with
> those darn 4 wheel drive trucks.  Have any of you guys had any experience with
> that at your fields and what did you do to combat it?  Eddie Fulmer Pres. West
> Alabama Aero Modelers...
WTH - 16 May 2004 23:47 GMT
Paul McIntosh <paul@mcintoshcentral.com> bored us with:

> West Alabama?  Good luck!
>
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>> had any experience with that at your fields and what did you do to
>> combat it?  Eddie Fulmer Pres. West Alabama Aero Modelers...

Oops, sorry, my post was redundant.

   WTH
WTH - 16 May 2004 23:47 GMT
Efulmer <efulmer@aol.com> bored us with:

> Well it's getting regular that someone is cutting circles in our
> field with those darn 4 wheel drive trucks.  Have any of you guys had
> any experience with that at your fields and what did you do to combat
> it?  Eddie Fulmer Pres. West Alabama Aero Modelers...

Start laying out caltrops in the grass when you're finished.  At around
$400/tire, they'll soon start looking elsewhere to 4x4.

   WTH
C.O.Jones - 17 May 2004 00:02 GMT
> Well it's getting regular that someone is cutting circles in our field with
> those darn 4 wheel drive trucks.  Have any of you guys had any experience with
> that at your fields and what did you do to combat it?  Eddie Fulmer Pres. West
> Alabama Aero Modelers...

Depends considerably on local laws, ownership of the property, etc., etc.
Most places would require input from the land owner to get the police
involved.  If the land owner doesn't care, you could be out of luck.
Whatever you do, don't do anything that may damage the vehicles, puncture
tires, etc., until you check with local law enforcement.  That kind of
irresponsible and immature activity does nothing but make you the bad guys
and you could find yourselves facing criminal charges and/or a law suit as a
result.

Check with your land lord and with local law enforcement and see what can be
done.  In the meantime, you might try having a couple of guys spend a night
out there to get the culprits on film.  That alone may be enough to chase
them away.

Good luck and keep us posted!

Chuck
Scotty - 17 May 2004 01:40 GMT
"Crop Circles"?
> Well it's getting regular that someone is cutting circles in our field with
> those darn 4 wheel drive trucks.  Have any of you guys had any experience with
> that at your fields and what did you do to combat it?  Eddie Fulmer Pres. West
> Alabama Aero Modelers...
Tom Johnson - 17 May 2004 19:14 GMT
A little dis-information can go a long way. One of the bike paths in
town was having trouble along the same lines. Every time I saw a
vehicle nearby I would approach in an overly friendly manner and
sympathetically "warn" the drivers how the authorities have been
cracking down on folks driving where they should not be. Mention one
or two guys you "saw" get $800 fines and an "impound" on their
vehicle. Word of mouth will eventually get back to most of the problem
people, and you have recruited others in your cause. I was amazed at
how quickly this worked in this case. If it works for the CIA, why not
us?

How about contacting a local 4 wheel drive club? These folks are
responsible hobbyists and might have some good ideas and knowledge of
local problems. Many clubs are associated with local law enforcement
agencies for search and rescue, giving you some inside avenues to
pursue the problem.

Tom

> Well it's getting regular that someone is cutting circles in our field with
> those darn 4 wheel drive trucks.  Have any of you guys had any experience with
> that at your fields and what did you do to combat it?  Eddie Fulmer Pres. West
> Alabama Aero Modelers...
Rumprider - 17 May 2004 20:04 GMT
It happens at ouf field constantly - we are putting up a chain.  Another
area field has trenched all around their field.  We can never seem to catch
these morons.
> Well it's getting regular that someone is cutting circles in our field with
> those darn 4 wheel drive trucks.  Have any of you guys had any experience with
> that at your fields and what did you do to combat it?  Eddie Fulmer Pres. West
> Alabama Aero Modelers...
Charlie Wolf - 17 May 2004 20:26 GMT
If it were me, I'd take a clue from the terrorists in Iraq and set up
some IED's....
Regards,

>Well it's getting regular that someone is cutting circles in our field with
>those darn 4 wheel drive trucks.  Have any of you guys had any experience with
>that at your fields and what did you do to combat it?  Eddie Fulmer Pres. West
>Alabama Aero Modelers...
Charlie Wolf - 17 May 2004 20:53 GMT
Ya know - your post got me to thinking....

I'm assuming this is happening at night.  What about burying a few
well placed steel pipes in the ground - short sections about 2 feet
long and an i.d. of about 2".  these could easily be capped so
aircraft tires pass over the top of them.  When the field is secured,
take the caps off and place some cutoff sections of steel fence posts
(like those used for electric fencing) into the holes.  Cut them off
so they stick up about 18".  Anybody that drove over them with a four
wheel drive pickup would end up with serious repair bills.  If anybody
asks - you used them for balloon breaking masts for RC events.

This assumes that you OWN the property the field is on...
Regards,

>Well it's getting regular that someone is cutting circles in our field with
>those darn 4 wheel drive trucks.  Have any of you guys had any experience with
>that at your fields and what did you do to combat it?  Eddie Fulmer Pres. West
>Alabama Aero Modelers...
slk - 17 May 2004 21:54 GMT
I got two words for ya...mine field.

>>Well it's getting regular that someone is cutting circles in our field with
>>those darn 4 wheel drive trucks.  Have any of you guys had any experience with
>>that at your fields and what did you do to combat it?  Eddie Fulmer Pres. West
>>Alabama Aero Modelers...
C.O.Jones - 18 May 2004 00:20 GMT
> I got two words for ya...mine field.

Hmmmm!   You know, after reading some of these responses!  I'm no longer
quite as shocked as I was over the behavior of a few troops in an Iraqi
prison.  I now understand where they got it from.  No doubt learned it from
people back here.
The Natural Philosopher - 18 May 2004 01:04 GMT
>>I got two words for ya...mine field.
>
> Hmmmm!   You know, after reading some of these responses!  I'm no longer
> quite as shocked as I was over the behavior of a few troops in an Iraqi
> prison.  I now understand where they got it from.  No doubt learned it from
> people back here.

Yeah, Rumsfeld, Bush, Cheney etc. etc.

Quis custodies custodiet?
Red Scholefield - 18 May 2004 01:31 GMT
Then don't worry about the overseers bailing out your pitiful welfare island
the next time some European despot wants it for reason known only to him.

RS

> >>I got two words for ya...mine field.
> >
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>
> Quis custodies custodiet?
Six_O'Clock_High - 18 May 2004 05:27 GMT
> >>I got two words for ya...mine field.
> >
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>
> Quis custodies custodiet?

Hey D.H.,
I guess you really got a charge of that guy getting his head hacked off
becuase he happened to be an AMERICAN.  Maybe you should go visit your
friends in Iraq.
C.O.Jones - 18 May 2004 10:45 GMT
> Yeah, Rumsfeld, Bush, Cheney etc. etc.
>
> Quis custodies custodiet?

Amazing!  Even your Latin sucks!  But in response to your question, show me
one worthy of being the custodian!
Red Scholefield - 18 May 2004 01:12 GMT
And you Mr. Jones (or Kline, or whoever you are) are the reason why our
country keeps getting crapped on!

RS

> > I got two words for ya...mine field.
>
> Hmmmm!   You know, after reading some of these responses!  I'm no longer
> quite as shocked as I was over the behavior of a few troops in an Iraqi
> prison.  I now understand where they got it from.  No doubt learned it from
> people back here.
C.O.Jones - 18 May 2004 10:49 GMT
> And you Mr. Jones (or Kline, or whoever you are) are the reason why our
> country keeps getting crapped on!
>
> RS

Not hardly Mr. Scholefield!  It's because of people who teach and allow our
youth to commit such atrocities!  It's all a matter of values and ethics.
Are you one of those people?  I for one would lock up those young
degenerates and throw away the key.  After giving them the spanking they
deserve!

What would the "Greatest Generation" (yours) do about it?
Red Scholefield - 18 May 2004 13:33 GMT
> > And you Mr. Jones (or Kline, or whoever you are) are the reason why our
> > country keeps getting crapped on!
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> What would the "Greatest Generation" (yours) do about it?

It would have been "corrected" before they were capable of such actions,
like at about 2 years old if such tendencies were noted by parents that were
involved in raising them!  Before they had any thoughts about "self esteem",
"diversity",  hidden identities or any of the other liberal garbage they are
raised on today.

No reply is necessary - lets stick to the intent of this forum.

RS
C.O.Jones - 19 May 2004 00:59 GMT
> No reply is necessary - lets stick to the intent of this forum.

You mean like your attack on MJC in another thread?  Intent like that?
jim breeyear - 18 May 2004 15:49 GMT
Parents "bring up the children" , the NEA teaches them the adjenda!

>>And you Mr. Jones (or Kline, or whoever you are) are the reason why our
>>country keeps getting crapped on!
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> What would the "Greatest Generation" (yours) do about it?
Matthew P. Cummings - 19 May 2004 00:59 GMT
> Not hardly Mr. Scholefield!  It's because of people who teach and allow our
> youth to commit such atrocities!  It's all a matter of values and ethics.

I agree it's an atrocity to tear up our fields like that, but what are you
to do when you can't catch them to spank their a.ses?

Answer, catch their cars...  Then them when they show up for them, then
you can spank them good.

Softy, I'd like to see them lose the car, license, and go to jail for
destruction of property.  A beating would go a long ways towards making me
feel better, then they would have to fix the damage, then off to the poky.
Charlie Wolf - 18 May 2004 14:27 GMT
Oh lighten up ferchrissakes....
Regards,

>> I got two words for ya...mine field.
>
>Hmmmm!   You know, after reading some of these responses!  I'm no longer
>quite as shocked as I was over the behavior of a few troops in an Iraqi
>prison.  I now understand where they got it from.  No doubt learned it from
>people back here.
C.O.Jones - 19 May 2004 00:57 GMT
> Oh lighten up ferchrissakes....
> Regards,

So you approve of modelers suggesting what amounts to acts of vandalism and
vengeance in response to others irresponsible behavior?
Paul McIntosh - 19 May 2004 07:50 GMT
I do!  Post the appropriate warnings and do what you like.  As long as you
don't do anything to threaten their lives, go for it!

BTW, what would YOU do if they decided to invade YOUR flying site every
month in the middle of the night?

--
Paul McIntosh
http://www.rc-bearings.com

> > Oh lighten up ferchrissakes....
> > Regards,
>
> So you approve of modelers suggesting what amounts to acts of vandalism and
> vengeance in response to others irresponsible behavior?
C.O.Jones - 19 May 2004 12:17 GMT
> I do!  Post the appropriate warnings and do what you like.  As long as you
> don't do anything to threaten their lives, go for it!
>
> BTW, what would YOU do if they decided to invade YOUR flying site every
> month in the middle of the night?

Considering the property in question, I suspect they would simply enter
through the gate.  Cutting the lock or some such.  In which case, the
cameras would have it all on tape.  And if not, it's amazing what sizeable
and regular donations to the policeman's fund will do for the investigative
process.  Care to come and give it a try Paul?

But the bottom line is, I would catch them!  Eventually!  Without stooping
to their level of immaturity and cowardice.  Then I would own them!
Paul McIntosh - 19 May 2004 19:37 GMT
You would be able to get them for simple trespass at most unless you have
corrupt cops and judges capable of being "bought".  You wouldn't "own" them.
We had a Sheriff in charge of flight operations for the department as a
member and he couldn't do any more than that.

--
Paul McIntosh
http://www.rc-bearings.com

> > I do!  Post the appropriate warnings and do what you like.  As long as you
> > don't do anything to threaten their lives, go for it!
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> But the bottom line is, I would catch them!  Eventually!  Without stooping
> to their level of immaturity and cowardice.  Then I would own them!
C.O.Jones - 19 May 2004 22:43 GMT
> You would be able to get them for simple trespass at most unless you have
> corrupt cops and judges capable of being "bought".  You wouldn't "own" them.
> We had a Sheriff in charge of flight operations for the department as a
> member and he couldn't do any more than that.

Things are different in horse country!  I would suspect a horses a.s like
yourself would know that!
MikeF - 22 May 2004 11:03 GMT
> But the bottom line is, I would catch them!  Eventually!  Without stooping
> to their level of immaturity and cowardice.  Then I would own them!

Stooping to their level would invovle sneaking over to thier houses at night and putting
sugar in their gas tank. No one suggested that (yet...)
Laying spike strips or other traps is passive - it only works when THEY initiate the
crime. In many areas, its still legal to shoot at trespassers. Spike strips by comparison
would be a kindness.
And certainly the 'land mine' comment was a joke. I imagine they would take out far more
aircraft than 4x4's.

And finally, catching them is wayyy easier said than done. Whaddya gonna do? walk out
there at midnight, hold up your hand and say "Stop, in the name of the law!"...pleez.
Videotape? Nope. Try getting a license plate - even if they HAD one - off a 4x4 covered in
mud, bouncing around, AT NIGHT. While your at it, zoom in on the VIN number on the
dashboard....
C.O.Jones - 22 May 2004 13:43 GMT
> > But the bottom line is, I would catch them!  Eventually!  Without stooping
> > to their level of immaturity and cowardice.  Then I would own them!
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
> mud, bouncing around, AT NIGHT. While your at it, zoom in on the VIN number on the
> dashboard....

I never said it would be easy to catch them.  Though depending on the
situation it could prove to be just that.  However, it would be far better
than to play the childish games being proposed here and endangering others
simply for a sense of revenge!  Because that is all this discussion is
really about, childish revenge!

Grow up you guys!
MikeF - 22 May 2004 15:45 GMT
The digging of deep pits and such really are a bad idea all around.
remember the guy who sued and WON because while he was robbing somebodys house, he tripped
and fell on their poorly lit stairs.
Flattening tires is one thing, but something that would certainly injure or kill is quite
another.

> .... play the childish games being proposed here and endangering others
> simply for a sense of revenge!  Because that is all this discussion is
> really about, childish revenge!

No, this is clearly about keeping your field - that you work rather hard on - neat and
usable.
Revenge would simply be icing on the cake....

> Grow up you guys!
Bill - 18 May 2004 00:40 GMT
We had a similar problem. Our field is accessed by going up an road
that serves as an irrigation canal access. We had problems with guys
doing the circle cut, playing "Hide-the-weenie" with their girl
friends, etc. We solved the problem by getting the county to let us
put in a gate. Pretty much solved the problem. They can still get in,
but they have to work at it.

The old timers in the club told me an interesting story. The guy who
used to own our field (He GAVE us the land about eight years ago)
found a stalled car in the middle of the field one early Saturday
morning. There was no doubt that at the time they broke an axle, they
were cutting some fine circles in our grass. They also left long
burnout strips down the asphalt runway. This car had been seen doing
this on at least four other occasions.
The guy proceeded to take a baseball bat to that car. Windows, head
and tail lights, and various body panels received the "Custom by
crunch" treatment.
THEN, he waited around for the guys to collect the car. When they
finally showed up, they were arrested. (They got a slap on the wrist
for tresspassing and vandalism) Nobody ever found out who tore up that
car, though.
Bill

> Well it's getting regular that someone is cutting circles in our field with
> those darn 4 wheel drive trucks.  Have any of you guys had any experience with
> that at your fields and what did you do to combat it?  Eddie Fulmer Pres. West
> Alabama Aero Modelers...
Nicholas Dinh - 20 May 2004 18:30 GMT
Gotta love it!!!  Awesome.  CO, I guess there is a solution where no one
gets hurt.  ;)

Nick

> We had a similar problem. Our field is accessed by going up an road
> that serves as an irrigation canal access. We had problems with guys
[quoted text clipped - 23 lines]
>>that at your fields and what did you do to combat it?  Eddie Fulmer Pres. West
>>Alabama Aero Modelers...
Ted Campanelli - 18 May 2004 01:16 GMT
On 5/16/2004 5:42 PM Ted shuffled out of his cave and grunted these
great (and sometimes not so great) words of knowledge:

One thing you can do, however this will require some manpower, is dig a
trench about 3' - 4' wide x 5' - 6' deep across the width of the field.
 Put some 1/4" ply over the trench and place the sod you removed on top
of the trench.  If the ply sags from the weight of the sod, place some
2x2 vertically under it about every 3' - 4' for support.  During the day
 the club members can see where the trench is and not walk on it, and,
unless you are flying VERY HEAVY planes, you have use of the field.  You
should find some 4x4s "lawn darted" in the morning.

As far as anyone is concerned, The trench is for providing protection
for a camera man who is (will be in the near future) taking action
photos/movies of the planes.

Since you lease the flying field and maintain it (cut the grass, seed,
fertilizer, roll it, etc), you should be able to do what you would like
(within reason of course) at/on the field.  Obviously, the "camera man's
pit" will have to be filled back in "at a future date".

> Well it's getting regular that someone is cutting circles in our field with
> those darn 4 wheel drive trucks.  Have any of you guys had any experience with
> that at your fields and what did you do to combat it?  Eddie Fulmer Pres. West
> Alabama Aero Modelers...
Matthew P. Cummings - 19 May 2004 00:54 GMT
> Since you lease the flying field and maintain it (cut the grass, seed,
> fertilizer, roll it, etc), you should be able to do what you would like

I know of a business that had this problem, they thought they could solve
it by seeding the yard with trinkets.

Well, one morning they arrived to find it torn up so bad that it boggled
the mind.  Turns out the guilty party had to fix 4 tires and got real
pissed off.

We've never managed to solve it on our field.  But once the owner had a
talk with the culprit it stopped being as bad.  I tracked him down via
tire tracks and the owner got tough with him, helped for a while.
 
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