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Model Forum / Radio Controlled / Air Models / May 2007Tower Flat-Out foamy EP plane
Has anyone here in the USA bought and built a foamy FlatOut 3D EP (example: Extra 300S GPMA1114) from Tower Hobbies? First problem! I'm having a difficult time identifying the various black nylon injection molded parts in the two grids? Can anyone help me identify these parts? Without knowing the identity of all these parts, it's difficult to follow the instructions. Second problem! I believe it's IMPOSSIBLE to snap the Z-bend clevis(s) into the control horn(s) as the instructions tell you. Is there a secret to this? How can it be done? I've broken one clevis already, trying to snap it into a control horn. I hope there's a couple spares in this kit! Third problem! The instructions manual is printed in black/white/gray-scale, so it's very difficult to understand the assembly procedures from the pictures and word description. If I cannot come to a conclusion within a few days, it's going back to Tower Hobbies. I understand the foamy model cannot be returned because it's been started, but the rest of the supporting hardware and electronics CAN and will be retuned. The retail cost of the electronics and hardware is: $230.50 Any and All help or advice will be appreciated. ________________________________ Earl Scherzinger 'AMA' #40329 I have just (nearly) finished putting one of these (flatana) together, and agree they are a bit of a bugger. > Has anyone here in the USA bought and built a foamy FlatOut 3D EP (example: > Extra 300S GPMA1114) from Tower Hobbies? [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Without knowing the identity of all these parts, it's difficult to follow > the instructions. If you look closely you will see that each part is identified by its name on the black frame - ie C1, C2 etc. The names are moulded in, and are a little hard to read. You can relate these to the list of parts at the front of the manual where it details the quantity of each part. > Second problem! > I believe it's IMPOSSIBLE to snap the Z-bend clevis(s) into the control > horn(s) as the instructions tell you. Is there a secret to this? How can it > be done? I've broken one clevis already, trying to snap it into a control > horn. I hope there's a couple spares in this kit! You have to be very very careful AND make sure you scrape ALL the flashing off the parts before trying to assemble them. I found scraping them with amy hobby knife did the trick. Also, use a drill to clear out holes etc before inserting bits into them - eg the hinges and the control rods etc > Third problem! > The instructions manual is printed in black/white/gray-scale, so it's very > difficult to understand the assembly procedures from the pictures and word > description. If I cannot come to a conclusion within a few days, it's going > back to Tower Hobbies. If this is your first model then I suggest you put it aside until you gain more experience. I am not an expert by any stretch of the imagination, but have assembled about half a dozen ARFs. And found this to be the hardest of them all - took me ages, and I haven't made a good job of it at all. > I understand the foamy model cannot be returned > because it's been started, but the rest of the supporting hardware and > electronics CAN and will be retuned. The retail cost of the electronics and > hardware is: $230.50 If yu have bought the brushless upgrade bits then it might be worthwhile to keep those and buy another model to use them with - but not a flatout. One further thing - as I am informed by members of my club who do know what they are talking about, these are not easy planes to fly. They are very sensitive, and do not glide well. They would definately not be a good choice as a first plane. cheers David Bugger And I was just looking at this one http://www.hobbyoutlets.com/store/hobby/gpma1114-great-planes-extra-300s-flatout s-3d-ep-arf-355.html is it any good ? > Has anyone here in the USA bought and built a foamy FlatOut 3D EP > (example: Extra 300S GPMA1114) from Tower Hobbies? [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > ________________________________ > Earl Scherzinger 'AMA' #40329 Mike, That's the right FlatOut 3D EP foamy plane. After three hours of study, I finally identified all the molded pieces. If anybody needs a copy, send me your email address and I'll email a *.jpg or *PDF copy. Each piece is identified with the Letter & Number in the instructions book. Quietguy, OK, how did you manage to 'punch' all those Z-bends through those undersized holes? I'm waiting for an answer! You have three days to answer, then all the hardware and electronics are being returned. On the other hand, I'm really hoping to finish this small plane. It will be my indoor fun machine for the winter. ________________________________ Earl Scherzinger * Earl@Scherzinger.org RC 'AMA' #40329 > Bugger > And I was just looking at this one [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] >> ________________________________ >> Earl Scherzinger 'AMA' #40329 > Mike, > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > OK, how did you manage to 'punch' all those Z-bends through those undersized > holes? I'm waiting for an answer! I scraped all the flashing off both bits. Ran my hobby knife blade around the inside of the hole, and scraped the outside of the z bit carefully to remove ALL the flashing. Then sweated and wiggled, and wobbled and said little prayers - they all went to together OK. I did bust the hinge bit with the control arm - had to glue one of the ordinary hinges to it, and enlarge the gap in the wing. > You have three days to answer, Thanks goodness I live in Oz - gave me an extra day :-) Good luck David According to one of the very experienced flyers at my club they are good - if built light they perform very well, are a reasonable price, and can be repaired when you crash. Juat a bit of a bugger to put together (for me) - for those with more experience with foamies they may be a cinch David > Bugger > And I was just looking at this one > http://www.hobbyoutlets.com/store/hobby/gpma1114-great-planes-extra-300s-flatout s-3d-ep-arf-355.html > is it any good ? The parts are labeled on the trees at the point where the parts are attached. All the hinges are labeled "C2". Those are the hinges that are inserted into the slots in the control surfaces. The rods have to be measured to find the correct ones for each application. As far as the clevis', you need to use a #11 hobby knife to clean up the hole before inserting the pushrod. Looking at the manual online it looks pretty straightforward. As I said, the parts are labeled on the trees, C1, C2, E1, A69, etc. My Flatana would probably be airworthy by now if it wasnt for the fact that I didnt have foam safe CA and then had to deal with Christmas and all that goes with it.  SignatureDan AMA605992 KE6ERB http://www.fubar1.net "I've heard the screams of the vegetables..." Take out the "trash" to reply > Has anyone here in the USA bought and built a foamy FlatOut 3D EP > (example: Extra 300S GPMA1114) from Tower Hobbies? [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > ________________________________ > Earl Scherzinger 'AMA' #40329 Dan Fubar (of the hill people) and Quietguy, Thanks for your help. I was looking at the wrong side of the grid. Even after I turned it over, I had to get my magnifying glass to read the numbers. My eyes aren't as good as when I was 25. Well what do you know, I got all of them right! Now, if I could just get these Z-bends in those tinny holes. Success! I cleaned the 'eye' hole out with a #11 blade AND I had to 'lightly' file the outside corner of the Z-bend. I've been building RC planes for many years but I never had this problem before. Thanks everybody for your help. I'm looking forward to a safe flight this week-end. Oops! The battery is on backorder. Damn! ________________________________ Earl Scherzinger * Earl@Scherzinger.org RC 'AMA' #40329 > The parts are labeled on the trees at the point where the parts are > attached. All the hinges are labeled "C2". Those are the hinges that are [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] >> ________________________________ >> Earl Scherzinger 'AMA' #40329 Yeah, they arent easy to see. I have now outgrown the length of my arms and had to resort to Sav-on (rite-aid, CVS, etc.) cheapo reading glasses to see the tiny parts and printing. Getting older sucks. Oh well, beats the alternative! > Dan Fubar (of the hill people) and Quietguy, > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > RC 'AMA' #40329 > I've been building RC planes for many years but I never had this problem > before. Earl, are you saying that you've never had to adjust the fit of a part on any of the airplanes you've built in the past? That's truly amazing. I find that I am constantly reaming the holes in servo arms and control horns to get the pushrods to fit. I'm always widening the hinge slots to get control surfaces to line up. I'm always sanding ARF wing roots for a nice tight joint. If you're used to that, then this should be no different. My guess is that you're having so much trouble because you've never put together a plastic model. The construction techniques used in assembling a Flatout are more like that of putting together a Testor's model than putting together an ARF, or even building a standard balsa-and-ply kit. As you've found out, all the parts sprues are numbered, and as I recall from my Turmoil build, the instructions call for the parts by the numbers on the sprues. I liked the way my Turmoil flew, but I broke most of the hinges just trying to assemble the plane. Most every piece of foam had at least one "scar" from where it broke and I had to glue it back together before the first flight. I must've cracked the rudder in half a dozen places. When it broke after the 3rd flight, I tossed it. I suggest you get some kicker with the glue - I didn't and it was a real bastard holding bits together for up to 5 minutes waiting for that stuff to stick David > My Flatana would probably be airworthy by now if it wasnt for the fact that > I didnt have foam safe CA and then had to deal with Christmas and all that > goes with it. Bought some just this afternoon! I think Im set and good to go on the build. SignatureDan AMA605992 KE6ERB http://www.fubar1.net "I've heard the screams of the vegetables..." Take out the "trash" to reply >I suggest you get some kicker with the glue - I didn't and it was a real > bastard holding bits together for up to 5 minutes waiting for that stuff [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >> that >> goes with it. Earl, I can't help you with your first 2 problems. However for problem #3, I have a solution for you. If you go to the Electrifly website for the FlatOut models..... http://www.electrifly.com/flatoutindex.html you will find a .pdf copy of the assembly manual for each of the flatout models. Just click on the model you have, and in the page that opens there is a link to download the manual in .pdf format. Since these copies are not printed they are very clear and easy to see (but still grayscale). Don't try to print the manual out, just look at it on your computer for reference. You will need to have a copy of Adobe Acrobat Reader installed on your computer to read the file. If you don't have Acrobat Reader it is available for free at the Adobe website. Hope this helps Ken > Has anyone here in the USA bought and built a foamy FlatOut 3D EP > (example: Extra 300S GPMA1114) from Tower Hobbies? [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > ________________________________ > Earl Scherzinger 'AMA' #40329 Ken, Thanks for imput! That same instructions manual came with the plane. The problem was the gray-tone photos are hard to identify with the parts. My advise! If you've never had a FlatOut foamy before, study the manual CAREFULLY before you start. It appears to be a fun EP plane. Buy it! ________________________________ Earl Scherzinger * Earl@Scherzinger.org RC 'AMA' #40329 > Earl, > [quoted text clipped - 42 lines] >> ________________________________ >> Earl Scherzinger 'AMA' #40329 I have a question about the servo horns included with the ki (Extra300S). They won't fit any of my servos (they are the smal BlueBird servos that LightFlight RC sells). What servos do I nee **OTHER** than the Futaba ones mentioned in the manual, which have special connector which require a special receiver -- Don H Ted shuffled out of his cave and grunted these great (and sometimes not so great) words of knowledge: > I have a question about the servo horns included with the kit > (Extra300S). They won't fit any of my servos (they are the small > BlueBird servos that LightFlight RC sells). What servos do I need > **OTHER** than the Futaba ones mentioned in the manual, which have a > special connector which require a special receiver? I use BlueBird servos and have not had the problem you describe. I use Sullivan Golden Clevis exclusively on all my planes and with one exception they worked fine. The one exception I had, I had to enlarge the hole in the control horn on the control surface about 1/64". For the servo arms I use DuBro "Quick Connects" which require drilling the hole in the servo arm with a 1/16" or 5/64" bit to accept the quick disconnects. The servo horns that come in the kit have HUGE holes, there's no wa that I could drill out the little arms that come with the bluebir servos that large...the hole would be almost as large as the servo ar is wide. I just re-read your reply, and I think you may not understand what I' talking about...NOT the control horns on the rudder, ailerons an elevator, the one on the servo itself. This kit requires you use th servo arms included inside the kit. Those have larger splined hole than the shaft sticking out of the top of the servo -- Don H Don, It sounds like you have or bought the wrong size servos. That model calls for Micro or Nano servos which usually have the very small horns. The push rods that come with the model are carbon (very thin) and will fit the Micro servo. I had the same plane but I couldn't get the hinges to work, so I gave up and sold it at half price. I don't have the patents any longer for models light that. You can see ALL my models AND MUCH MORE information on my website at <http://rcobsession.net> Please sign my 'Guest Book' when you leave. EarlOfTroy AMA 40329 > The servo horns that come in the kit have HUGE holes, there's no way > that I could drill out the little arms that come with the bluebird [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > servo arms included inside the kit. Those have larger splined holes > than the shaft sticking out of the top of the servo. I don't HAVE the servos yet, I just want to know what kind of servo OTHER THAN the Futaba one recommended in the instruction manual wil fit the control horns. The servos I want to use will have to hav normal JR connectors not the mini specialized Futaba connectors -- Don H Ok, never mind...I went to the local hobby shop and the JR sub-micr servos they had fit -- Don H > Ok, never mind...I went to the local hobby shop and the JR sub-micro > servos they had fit. How much were they? mk $14 each -- Don H |
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