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Model Forum / General / Models / October 2005Great decal paper
I was building the Tamiya Williams F1 car, and needed to carbon fiber many areas. I bought a sheet of carbon fiber decals (brand not to be mentioned) and it was junk- the stuff just would not adhere. I had just gotten a shipment from MicroMark of decal paper. I scanned the image from the store-bought decals and made my own using the Micromark paper. It is great. I have used this paper before, but only for simple numbers that I didn't have to wrap around compound curves, so I was amazed at how well this stuff works! It easily stretches to conform, yet is very strong- you can even pat surface after using micro-sol! And the adhesion is great- in fact be sure they are on straight before they dry, 'cause only way to get them off is to sand them off. I used micro-set below and on top of decals, followed by micro-sol. I have no connection to MM or whoever makes the paper for them, but I intend to use their decal paper from now on. Great stuff! What type of printer did you use? Laser? Ink jet? Thanks, Martin > What type of printer did you use? Laser? Ink jet? > > Thanks, > > Martin I have a laser B&W and a color inkjet. I bought a package of both their inkjet and their laser/copier paper. Since the carbon fiber was a grey pattern, I used the laser printer. I have not tried the inkjet paper with the inkjet printer yet. I'll report to the group when I do. Going a bit OT, the reason I bought the laser was ink costs on the inkjet printer. I print a lot of text, and was frequently buying black cartridges. The laser printer cost per page is a small fraction of the ink cost per page. I paid 200 bucks for the Brothers laser- figured I paid for it in a couple of years, plus it would make black decals for me before inkjet paper came out. I see laser printers now for 99.95, so they are an even better deal now. With lots of USB ports on newer computers, no problem having them on computer at same time. Don Stauffer <stauffer@usfamily.net> wrote in news:fqQ1f.1$gK3.601 @news.uswest.net: > ink cost per page. I paid 200 bucks for the Brothers laser- figured I > paid for it in a couple of years, plus it would make black decals for me > before inkjet paper came out. I see laser printers now for 99.95, so > they are an even better deal now. With lots of USB ports on newer I saw a color laser at Walmart about a month ago for less than $300. I'm waiting to move back to the mainland and I think I'll get one. I'm amazed how the price has come down on those. TF > Don Stauffer <stauffer@usfamily.net> wrote in news:fqQ1f.1$gK3.601 > @news.uswest.net: [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > TF I saw one on sale the other day for eighty bucks! It was regularly a hundred, but there was a twenty buck rebate! A hundred bucks is getting to be a regular price for the low end lasers. Even the color lasers are coming down. I saw low end color lasers for $300. On the other hand, if the inkjet paper I also bought from Micro Mark works, I won't need a color laser. I will let folks know soon. >> Don Stauffer <stauffer@usfamily.net> wrote in news:fqQ1f.1$gK3.601 >> @news.uswest.net: [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] >$300. On the other hand, if the inkjet paper I also bought from Micro >Mark works, I won't need a color laser. I will let folks know soon. Do factor in the cost of colour laser toner. here in the UK individual colours can cost up to the equivalent of $180 and there are three - the black is normally a bit cheaper. Also, i would expect the relative costs to be less in the US but you should check the price of toner as it is significant in the running costs David <dnews@bbbweb.com> wrote in message > Do factor in the cost of colour laser toner. > > David That's good advice on any printer/copier purchase. That and availability. A former employer would always opt for the best upfront deal on office equipment - which 9 times out of 10 meant that it was obsolete or nearly so and obtaining replacement parts and refills was going to be costly and time consuming. WmB this is why as a graphic designer, I only buy Canon inkjet printers and keep them clean as a whistle. I have a 5 year old BJC 8200 and a year old i965 - the wonderful thing about them is they both use the same BCI-6 cartridges which from Canon are $28Aussie - I buy repro's for $6, or $3.70 each if I buy bulk. The superb quality of the printing is something my clients always comment on........now, if I could only work out a way to make it print white! love my Canons :) Steve > <dnews@bbbweb.com> wrote in message >> Do factor in the cost of colour laser toner. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > WmB > this is why as a graphic designer, I only buy Canon inkjet printers and keep > them clean as a whistle. I have a 5 year old BJC 8200 and a year old i965 - [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Steve I hate mine. It went belly up less than a month after the warranty ran out. :-) Hope it will be not too expensive to fix- haven't got up the nerve to take it to shop yet. Hi Don What are the symptoms and what model is it? If the print head has died, then you're up for a new one, but surely they will have come down in price by now, seeing as the price of the printers has plummeted. Also, I would be contacting Canon to let them know how ordinary you think it is, having a product that dies a month after the warranty runs out. They're a big firm -they came to the party for me when mine died and the replacement (a refurb'd unit but who cares) is still going like a train - which is apt really. :) Mind you, I am not using it to make 500 pirate DVD covers each week, like on of my mates - but then his has never skipped a beat at all, lucky mug. Steve >> this is why as a graphic designer, I only buy Canon inkjet printers and >> keep them clean as a whistle. I have a 5 year old BJC 8200 and a year old [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > out. :-) Hope it will be not too expensive to fix- haven't got up the > nerve to take it to shop yet. > Do factor in the cost of colour laser toner. here in the UK individual > colours can cost up to the equivalent of $180 and there are three - [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > David Since I don't have a color laser, I cannot speak for color toner, but the black toner certainly is cheaper than ink- this was the reason I bought the laser- I figured it would pay for itself before long. Of course, I had a Lexmark printer at the time. I then saw tests in mags indicating Lexmark had the highest price for consumables of any major brand. My experience does bear out the magazine articles. A toner cartridge for my Brothers laser printer only costs about two and a half times what the black inkjet cartridge did, and it lasts FAR longer than two and a half times what the inkjet cartridge did. The articles said a full page of text would cost me about 5c on the laser printer, about 50c on inkjet. However, the added fringe benefit with the laser was that I could make black decals before the inkjet paper became available. > I saw one on sale the other day for eighty bucks! It was regularly a > hundred, but there was a twenty buck rebate! A hundred bucks is getting [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > $300. On the other hand, if the inkjet paper I also bought from Micro > Mark works, I won't need a color laser. I will let folks know soon. Lesson in electronic economics: basic trend on all new technology seems to be that as they get more popular, the cost comes down, look at TV's and CD players. The first CD player I saw was a Jim Disney's Stansbury Stereo shop down in Dundalk back in the 1970's. He had a little room in the back set up to demonstrate this wonderful new technology. Had the CD player hooked to a high end amplifier and a couple of real good speakers. Sound was gorgeous (CDs allow much better dynamic range) but the cost was somewhere around $7000 bucks for the CD player. I told him the thing would never catch on. Yeah! The local drug store has a player for under $100. I live in hopes that the Laser printers will come down still more, as the ALPS technology is going to be a dead item when it is no longer financially profitable to make the tape cartridges. Bill Shuey >> I saw one on sale the other day for eighty bucks! It was regularly a >> hundred, but there was a twenty buck rebate! A hundred bucks is getting [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > Bill Shuey now you can get a 52 x cdrw for $25. dvd's for $35.....the mind boggles. so let's see, i have edison cylinders, acetate 78's, reel to reel, 8 track, regular phono, mini-sette,mini-disc, cd-cdrw, dvd-dvdrw and absolutely no clue as to where or what format my copy of the first cab volt is. let's not talk visual media...... >I live in hopes that the Laser printers will come down still more, as the ALPS technology is >going to be a dead item when it is no longer financially profitable to >make the tape cartridges. I don't care if they come down to under $100 unless they can print white...  SignatureAl Superczynski, MFE, IPMS/USA #3795, continuous since 1968 My "From" address is munged - click "Reply To" to respond via email. Check out my want lists and eBay listings at "Al's Place": http://www.network54.com/realm/modeleral/ "Build what YOU like, the way YOU want to, and the critics will flame you every time." >> The local drug store has a player for under $100. I live in hopes that the Laser << Cd players are much cheaper than that. I've bought progressive scan dvd players for $20 with the optical output. > The first CD player I saw was a Jim Disney's Stansbury Stereo shop down >in Dundalk back in the 1970's. He had a little room in the back set up [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >somewhere around $7000 bucks for the CD player. I told him the thing >would never catch on. Yeah! That's pretty amazing when the "red book" (IEC908) standard wasn't even published until June 1980. The players were first demonstrated to selected audio journalists *within* manufacturers facilities in 1981. The first players went on sale to the public in late 1982 in the far east and early 1983 saw the worldwide launch. > Going a bit OT, the reason I bought the laser was ink costs on the > inkjet printer. Just a little note about ink usage.... The HP Officejets use less ink than Color Lasers. 30% less they say. and only $199 USD http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/us/en/sm/WF25a/18972-236251-236261-33100-f51-5013 77.html >> Going a bit OT, the reason I bought the laser was ink costs on the >> inkjet printer. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/us/en/sm/WF25a/18972-236251-236261-33100-f51-5013 77.html Is the Officejet a laser or inkjet. When I was talking about ink, I meant the COST of ink, not the volume. In various mags that ran tests on ink/toner costs, the cost per page was far less on lasers in general than inkjets, though inkjets certainly varied quite a bit between brands (it turns out what I had was the most expensive inkjet [lexmark] in terms of printing cost. >>> Going a bit OT, the reason I bought the laser was ink costs on the >>> inkjet printer. [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >(it turns out what I had was the most expensive inkjet [lexmark] in >terms of printing cost. The point I was making about colour lasers is that there are 4 toners inside so any cost b=gets multiplied up by 4 for any colour page you print. B&W still uses the single toner though David Don The Lexmark is truly expensive to operate. The enticement of a low pricetag led my wife to purchase a Lexmark Z25 for $29.00 after discounts. I thought this was great until she had to buy her first replacement cartridges- $49 for a colour, $29 for black. At my office, I inherited a Lexmark multifunction printer/scanner and fax which did not "synch" up properly with my laptop. The cost of the repair was outrageous so the serve technician mentioned that I could probably pick up a new machine for a great deal less. My mistake was in picking a Lexmark printer which came to only $49 but our first replacement cartridges were nearly $90. The machines aren't so bad, decent colour and speed but they are expensive in the long run. SignatureBill in my other life, a meek and mild librarian Zuk >Don > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >The machines aren't so bad, decent colour and speed but they are expensive >in the long run. one word-refills. or if you're a putz, refurbs. E Using refilled cartridges voids any warranty on your machine; they are invariably more messy and my experience shows that unless you are printing a huge amount, the more reliable performance of third-party or factory ink cartridges far outweighs the advantage of low price. My retailer does offer a special service, any cartridge returned to the store results in a free package of 500 sheets of paper, roughly the same cost savings as the refilled cartridge. After one refilled cartridge literally blew up in my printer and a series of problems in getting Epson cartridges refilled, I rely strictly on the factory version. SignatureBill in my other life, a meek and mild librarian Zuk >E > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >literally blew up in my printer and a series of problems in getting Epson >cartridges refilled, I rely strictly on the factory version. warranty shmarranty. messy? no more than superglue. if you learn to do it right, ie. correct amount of ink, they last a long time and cut the cost by 70% or more. refurbs can cut the cost by 2/3 and i've never had a refurb cart fail, unlike oem. if you can build a half a.s decent model, you can refill ink jet carts. honest. The time I tried refilling my color one, I didn't get the exact same volume of ink in each chamber(hard to do when you don't know how much is left of each color) and the print quality was terrible. I guessed it was because the pressure inside the resealed chambers wasn't equal so it didn't spray right but I don't know for sure. I never had trouble refilling the black, though. >>E >> [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > jet carts. > honest. E Warranty is important- I've had replacement printers supplied from the manufacturer due to the availability of a warranty and, in business, you don't shortcut areas such as warranty. This issue isn't as crucial as it once was in the heyday of paying $2000.00 for a printer. In today's computer world, a top printer in inkjet or laser versions. is now very affordable to the extent that the Lexmark my wife purchased, I seriously thought of it as a "throwaway" printer. (My premise was that at $29, use the printer, throw it away when the inks ran out and just buy a new one- a sort of "Bic" lighter approach. I realized later that the cartridges that were initially supplied must not have been filled to the same level as the replacement units.) As to the availability of refill systems for modern computer printers; the refill systems which I used for many years for my home computer printers do not adequately cover the newer models of multi-cartridge machines nor do they provide the full range of inks. Refilling was fine when there were one or two cartridges and there were no special inks/dyes to consider. In terms of price savings, reiterating my earlier comments, I purchase through a supplier that offers nearly the same price as a refilled or third-party cartridge through the use of discounting and store-based trade-in of the old cartridge for approximately a $10 package of paper. The overriding reality of having a messy, leaking cartridge is not one I want to deal with. I would rather pay the higher price to guarantee reliability and quality when printing. I submit most of my work as digital images but when there is a need for a printout, I still require a high quality, stable hard copy. I prefer the safety and reliability of new cartridges based on the philosophy that "it's the cost of doing business" and that "good business recovers its costs." SignatureBill in my other life, a meek and mild librarian Zuk >E > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >supplied must not have been filled to the same level as the replacement >units.) keep a set of eom original's and swap them for return. >As to the availability of refill systems for modern computer printers; the >refill systems which I used for many years for my home computer printers do >not adequately cover the newer models of multi-cartridge machines nor do >they provide the full range of inks. Refilling was fine when there were one >or two cartridges and there were no special inks/dyes to consider. google hundeds of sites with the right refills. >In terms of price savings, reiterating my earlier comments, I purchase >through a supplier that offers nearly the same price as a refilled or >third-party cartridge through the use of discounting and store-based >trade-in of the old cartridge for approximately a $10 package of paper. ok, whatever works for you. >The overriding reality of having a messy, leaking cartridge is not one I >want to deal with. I would rather pay the higher price to guarantee [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >cartridges based on the philosophy that "it's the cost of doing business" >and that "good business recovers its costs." never deal with mess or leaks. i rtfm and do fine. > if you can build a half a.s decent model, you can refill ink > jet carts. > honest. Ahh crap... looks like another trip to the stationers for me then... (c: RobG >> if you can build a half a.s decent model, you can refill ink >> jet carts. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >RobG wait! let me find the online guys i use. i think they're in georgia and their refill kits rock! really big bang for the buck and they have idiot proof instuctions. i bought 2 carts for a dead hp printer, (i didn't know it was dead) and even though the selas were off, they traded strait across for a huge three color refill kit for my lex. customer service is awesome.... ok, its ink-refills-ink.com. 3 20ml bottles and the tools for like $20 bucks or so. the ink is awesom and i've been using the shitty little "free" carts lexmark packed with the new printers for 10 months. i print cd labels by the ream...no, i don't own stock. > Don > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > The machines aren't so bad, decent colour and speed but they are expensive > in the long run. Shrewd!! Sell the printer dirt cheap and make your killing on the cartridges! Bill Shuey >>Don >> [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Bill Shuey They call it the Polaroid business model. >> Don >> [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Bill Shuey the "walmart" business models. they sell my lex z1100 3 in 1 for 58 bucks, the carts are almost 80. but i refill....never buy retail and print like a 30's anarchist. > Don > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > The machines aren't so bad, decent colour and speed but they are expensive > in the long run. Yep, that was my incentive to get the laser. Then when I wanted color print capability I saved up for a Canon S9000, a large format printer (13 x 19 inches, great for making photo backdrops). Ink was inexpensive. Then, just a couple of weeks after the warranty ran out, it went belly up :-( >>> Going a bit OT, the reason I bought the laser was ink costs on the >>> inkjet printer. [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > (it turns out what I had was the most expensive inkjet [lexmark] in > terms of printing cost. What I was referring to was the cost per print. I used to be a sales rep for computer related products and my understanding is that this Office jet is more cost effective on a per copy base and supposedly puts out a better print too. |
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