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Model Forum / General / Models / October 2005F-102 in SEAC colours?
Hi, I've come across a couple of photos of F-102s in SEAC colours but it is hard to make out serials, codes, etc. Does anyone have any info on the units which flew these camo'd acft, which serials, etc please? Also, did they have the Case X or XX wing, I guess I'll be ble to tell if I get the serial numbers. Any details welcome, thanks. Cheers, Ian On Fri, 21 Oct 2005 22:17:09 -0700, ianbw12 wrote: > Hi, > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Also, did they have the Case X or XX wing, I guess I'll be ble to tell > if I get the serial numbers. Most F-102s which were assigned to squadrons in Viet Nam were eventually painted in camoflage. Later on in the 1960s, most surviving F-102s were camoflaged. If you have photos, go from them. I recommend the F-102 "Detail and Scale" and "Colours and Markings" books by Bert Kinzey as well as Squadron's "F-102 in Europe". Colours were green 34079, green 34102 and tan 20400 over grey 36622. I have seen pictures of both case X and case XX wings so your best bet is to pick a photo and model that aircraft.  SignatureJessie C I know that the CT Air national Guard flew the camouflaged ones in the late 60's or early 70's, not exactly sure of the date or which serial numbers were used. I remember there was one of these at the Bradley air museum but it was destroyed in the tornado of 1979. I think they still have one as a gate guard on a pedestal so you may be able to contact the CT Air national Guard for more information. Dave > On Fri, 21 Oct 2005 22:17:09 -0700, ianbw12 wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > tan 20400 over grey 36622. I have seen pictures of both case X and case XX > wings so your best bet is to pick a photo and model that aircraft. <snip> Colours were green 34079, green 34102 and > tan 20400 over grey 36622. I have seen pictures of both case X and case XX > wings so your best bet is to pick a photo and model that aircraft. > > -- > Jessie C Jessie, Are you sure about the tan being FS 20400? IIRC that was primarily used in the "Southwest Asia" scheme. I believe the tan for the F-102 (and other "Vietnam Camo" aircraft) should have been FS 30219. Don McIntyre Clarksville, TN The SEA camouflage was the same for all aircraft. The Air Force technical order (TO 1-1-4) says the colors are: Green 34079, Green 34102, and Tan 30219 (upper surfaces) and Gray 36622 on lower surfaces. It does not distinguish between Case X and Case XX wings. > The SEA camouflage was the same for all aircraft. The Air Force > technical order (TO 1-1-4) says the colors are: Green 34079, Green > 34102, and Tan 30219 (upper surfaces) and Gray 36622 on lower surfaces. > > It does not distinguish between Case X and Case XX wings. When F-102s were first camoflaged, tan 20400 was used. This was not standard with other SEA camoflaged aircraft, and in colour pictures it is clearly lighter than tan 30219 which I agree is the standard SEA colour. I remember this because for the longest time that tan was unavailable in model paint. Check out the C&M book for the reference. SignatureJessie C There is a good article in WINGS magazine (February 1991, Volume 21, Number 1) which discusses the F-102s in Southeast Asia. The initial deployment from Clark AB, Philippines to Don Muang AB, Thailand (near Bangkok), Danang AB and Tan Son Nhut AB, RVN came in 1964. Units involved were the 509 Fighter Interceptor Squadron (from 405 TFW) to Danang (6 aircraft). The 51 TFW?s 16 Fighter Interceptor Squadron to Tan Son Nhut (12 airplanes) but this was taken over by the 509th within a couple of weeks (six airplanes). The ultimate disposition was: 405 TFW/Detachment 4 at Don Muang RTAFB; ADVON-2 at Danang AB, RVN and 509th ADVON-3/Det 3 at Tan Son Nhut AB, RVN. The 509th detachment at Tan Son Nhut was closed late in 1968. There was also a 509th detachment at Udorn RTAFB. The 64FIS also provided aircraft but was deactivated at Clark AB in December 1969. Here is a partial list of tail numbers. 64th Tail codes PE 070864 xxx335 xxx362 xxx444 xxx467 xxx964 509th Tail code PK xxx041 xxx154 xxx157 xxx200 xxx231 Thanks for that- can you please confirm does the xxx below mean same as 070? I have a low detail pic of two 'PK' machines with code numbers '13' and '379' in white. Cheers, Ian > 070864 > xxx335 [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > xxx200 > xxx231 The xxx in the serial numbers of my earlier posts meas that I could not determine the initial numbers due to the poor resolution of the photos. You'll have to do more research to find the leading digits. I also recall that some Air National Guard units in the US had the SEA camouflage but I don't know which ones. Hasegawa issued a SEA camo version in one of their earlier kits The instructions are in Japanese but it gives the numbers 313, 51 and 62 with tailcode 070884. Sorry I can't help with the wing. I hope that gives you something to go on. Mark > Hi, > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Cheers, > Ian > Hasegawa issued a SEA camo version in one of their earlier > kits [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] >> Cheers, >> Ian While we're on the subject, is there an explanation of the Case wing types anywhere? The Case X (Case Ten) wing was the original and had a turned-up wing tip. The leading edge was slightly turned down but only outboard of the outermost wing fence. The outer edge of the elevon was parallel to the centerline. The Case XX (Case Twenty) wing started with aircraft 56-1317. This was a change on the production line and there was no retrofitting of older aircraft. The wing was cambered to include the tip. Its elevon was angled to outboard. Bert Kinzey's "F-102 Delta Dagger In Detail & Scale" has a good photographic comparison on pages 52-53. Unfortunately, I don't know why the change was made but I can only assume that it was performance related. > The Case X (Case Ten) wing was the original and had a > turned-up wing [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > but I can > only assume that it was performance related. Thanks Rob. I bet now I know that, I won't have the right kit when the time comes to 'do' one ;) > Thanks Rob. I bet now I know that, I won't have the right > kit when the time > comes to 'do' one ;) If you work in 1/72, the Hasegawa kit's your only option, and it has case X wings. For case XX, the solution is to graft on F-106 wingtips. In 1/48, the current Revellogram/Promodeller kit has the case X wing. The first issue (in the yellow-border box) had the case XX wing, (and round wheels) but the moulds were permanently altered. It's getting hard to find now. I imagine that the same grafting of F-106 wingtips would work in this scale also but I haven't tried it. Yes, the change was performance related; it made landing and turning much easier at the cost of a couple of knots of top speed. SignatureJessie C Case X wing had a reflexed tip that reduced the ability to rotate. Case XX wing had a conical cambered leading edge that increased the downward 'curl' out to teh tip. It rotated more easily and you could hold the nose wheel off longer (aero drag) on landing. It also had a very noticeable 'ground effect' as it descended through half-span height on landing that was lacking in the Case X. Case XX also cruised more economically than Case X. I flew both of them and there was no problem telling them apart via flight characteristics nor making the choice as to which one to fly. BTW I was a flight instructor/examiner and maintenance test pilot in the Deuce logging about 1500 hours in the type. Walt BJ > Hi, > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Cheers, > Ian The Florida and New York ANG also flew camouflaged F-102s. A recent re-release of the 1/48 Monogram kit has decals for the latter. Curt |
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