 |
 | Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us |
 | Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network |
| HomeDiscussion Groups General ModelsRailroadsRocketsRadio Controlled Air ModelsHelicoptersLand ModelsWater ModelsModelGeeks.com Contact UsLink To UsSearch & Site Map |
Model Forum / General / Models / March 2006WWII USN fighters vs Luftwaffe fighters comparisons?
ISTR a site or book handicapping WWII USN fighters like the Corsair, Hellcat, Wildcat, etc, against WWII Luftwaffe fighters like the FW 190 & Me 109, since they didn't actually meet each other in combat (or did the RN do so?) I've googled & can't find anything. Anyone else recall this? > ISTR a site or book handicapping WWII USN fighters like the Corsair, > Hellcat, Wildcat, etc, against WWII Luftwaffe fighters like the FW 190 > & Me 109, since they didn't actually meet each other in combat (or did > the RN do so?) I've googled & can't find anything. Anyone else recall > this? I believe that Eric Brown did a couple of books that compared aircraft to aircraft as he evaluated them. Try googling Eric Brown and see what you come up with. Or someone here just *might* chirp in if they know what I'm referring to! --- Tontoni > > ISTR a site or book handicapping WWII USN fighters like the Corsair, > > Hellcat, Wildcat, etc, against WWII Luftwaffe fighters like the FW 190 [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > you come up with. Or someone here just *might* chirp in if they know > what I'm referring to! Not sure how much he compared aircraft to each other, but "Wings of the Luftwaffe", "Wings of the Navy" and "Wings of the Weird and Wonderful" (vols 1 & 2) give accounts of his experiences flying wartime and post-war types. And for what it's worth, when asked what his favourite aircraft was to fly, he replied"The de Havilland Hornet. Because it was so nice to fly an aircraft that was overpowered". Considering the W.W.II Fleet Air Arm types he started out on, I could see where he was coming from. Jon. >>> ISTR a site or book handicapping WWII USN fighters like the Corsair, >>>Hellcat, Wildcat, etc, against WWII Luftwaffe fighters like the FW 190 [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > Jon. I read that his favourite was the Fiesler Storch because it was such a delight to fly. John > > ISTR a site or book handicapping WWII USN fighters like the Corsair, > > Hellcat, Wildcat, etc, against WWII Luftwaffe fighters like the FW 190 [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > --- Tontoni Aeropause offered this under a different subject header: "Duels in the Sky-World War II Naval Aircraft in Combat" by Eric Brown. US version published by US Naval Institute 1988. (F4U and FW 190 on cover). Also "Allied vs Axis Aircraft" by G. D. Block, WE, Inc. dating from 1945. Brown's book is the one you probably want. ------ That's what I was talking about! Very cool stuff. (plus you gotta love anyone whose nickname is "Winkle"!) --- Tontoni >>> ISTR a site or book handicapping WWII USN fighters like the Corsair, >>>Hellcat, Wildcat, etc, against WWII Luftwaffe fighters like the FW 190 >>>& Me 109, since they didn't actually meet each other in combat (or did >>>the RN do so?) I've googled & can't find anything. Anyone else recall >>>this? One of the problems with these comparisons is that aircraft performance is highly dependent on altitude, and different planes are designed to be optimum at one flight altitude. It is frequently the case that plane A is superior at one altitude and plane B at another, so one has to pick the right altitude to answer the question. >>>> ISTR a site or book handicapping WWII USN fighters like the Corsair, >>>> Hellcat, Wildcat, etc, against WWII Luftwaffe fighters like the FW 190 [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > is superior at one altitude and plane B at another, so one has to pick > the right altitude to answer the question. Absolutely true. The Soviets took the "lowly" P-39, yanked stuff out of it to lower its weight and made it into a low-altitude terror. If a "souped up" P-39 could defeat an FW-190, and a Ki-43 could beat the P-39 over Guadalcanal, does that mean that a fleet of Ki-43's could whup a Luftwaffe flying FW-190's? I thinketh not... "Duels in the Sky-World War II Naval Aircraft in Combat" by Eric Brown. US version published by US Naval Institute 1988. (F4U and FW 190 on cover). Also "Allied vs Axis Aircraft" by G. D. Block, WE, Inc. dating from 1945. Brown's book is the one you probably want. > ISTR a site or book handicapping WWII USN fighters like the Corsair, > Hellcat, Wildcat, etc, against WWII Luftwaffe fighters like the FW 190 > & Me 109, since they didn't actually meet each other in combat (or did > the RN do so?) I've googled & can't find anything. Anyone else recall > this? Can't help you on the book - but it goes without saying that the RN employed US fighter types in notable action against the Luftwaffe - and the Japanese too. RN Hellcats flew on one of the many missions against the Tirpitz in Norway, for instance. Dunno 'bout Fw 190s and Me 109s, but F6F Hellcats in US hands operating from jeep carriers in the Med bagged a section of Ju 52s along the Cote d'Azure in the summer of '44 during Operation Dragoon. I think the bulk of Hellcat action in Southern France was similar to what the USAAF was doing in the summer of '44 with their P-47s - namely, tearing up ground targets. Good luck on the book. WmB Wasn't there some kind of project that went on between Germany and Japan. Where they were able to re-engineer some of their Fighter planes because Germany had sent some Fw-190's for evaluation or analysis to develop some kind of -new- Japanese Super Fighter or something. Is it what may have become the , and didn't they start out using a Big Old Daimler Benz -or- Junkers engine for what they ''Frankenstiend'' in the factory. Would we have had any Planes in the Pacific that could have been able to take out the later Fw-190's and how about the Me-109 and Fw-190 variants that had the 20mm & 30mm long barrel Wing mounted Cannons. Now I know it's always though of as being much too slow, but just a few of the Stuka ''Tank Buster'' would make short work of a Carrier Deck in a strafing run i'm thinking. Didn't they have a Large Cannon for the Fw-190 that was called the ''Can-Opener'' or something. What are your thoughts. ?? ... Carl .......... . Rama-Lama-BIG-BORG ; BORG TEMPLE N.Y. Central-Park-West ; Master Builder of blessed temple KITS ; Keeper of Secret Temple Decoder Rings & Bracelets ; Fluent-in-1st--Degree--TALK-to-the-HAND --TEMPLE-ETTE--Guards--SIX--&--SEVEN-- The----WORLD--WIDE--WEB----is totally jam packed with thousands of people who are Destined to be nothing more then a faded weatherbeaten ---CHALK--OUTLINE--- along the---INFORMATION--SUPER--HIGHWAY--- This is My Main Modeling Page and Web-Site http://community.webtv.net/CYBER-BORG-4/ThemodelsIlikethe And Introducing "SPOT -the- CAT" http://community.webtv.net/CYBER-BORG-4/MODELERSHELPERall A brief look into what is really me http://community.webtv.net/CYBER-BORG-4/HeresSomeReallyBig Yessss , I'm the -real- "Bad Santa" http://community.webtv.net/CYBER-BORG-4/COMEgetYourPresent The japanese had a Fw-190A and a Bf-109E for trials, but they didn't compare all that well to their own planes, and neither was in production in Japan. They used the idea of an inline engine in the Ki-61 Tony though, but production couldn't keep up with demand, and they re-engined the Tony with a radial and got the Ki-100 which proved better. The Japanese planes stood up to US planes pretty well, especially later planes, but in the late war their pilots did not. A Ju-87D with 37 mm guns would probably make a carrier deck useless in very short time, provided all the defending planes vere away, just as the Stuka didn't do well when there was fughters opposing it in Europe. The germans used both 20 and 30 mm canons in fighters, but they suffered from lower rate of fire compared to the standard UD .50 cal (12.7mm) But both the US and the Brits used 20mm later. The later german planes may have had equal qualities to later US and brittish planse, but so did later japanese planes, the major difference is that after 6-7 years of fighting even the best pilots will be worn out, and especially the US had so large a number of pilots, that they could train for a good long period before being in the thick of the fighting, the Axis powers did not have that oppertunity. The best guess is that with pilots of equal quality and training the tecknical side would not have given advantage to either side. -- Claus Gustafsen Strandby Denmark mail me at claus@gustafsen.nu See my modeling at www.gustafsen.nu Se min datters side om Fantasy på http://home20.inet.tele.dk/mymagicalworld > Wasn't there some kind of project that went on between Germany and > Japan. Where they were able to re-engineer [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > Yessss , I'm the -real- "Bad Santa" > http://community.webtv.net/CYBER-BORG-4/COMEgetYourPresent ---------------------------------------- Jeg beskyttes af den gratis SPAMfighter til privatbrugere. Den har indtil videre sparet mig for at fÃ¥ 813 spam-mails. Betalende brugere fÃ¥r ikke denne besked i deres e-mails. Hent gratis SPAMfighter her: www.spamfighter.dk Yesssss , I just can not begin to imagine what Stukas with cannons would be able to do to the flight deck of an Essex class Carrier. I think it safe to say it would a while before you were able to get planes back in the air again. Here's something I was thinking of as a variant. How about mounting the rocket packs to a Stuka with cannons as well as a Torpedo. Line it up with a ship and then empty the cannons into the side of it then drop the torp at the right time and hit the Rockets to climb at a fast enough rate so they couldn't track you with anti-aircraft to shoot you down. Does this sound like it would've worked in some kind of way. I think they would have been damn hard to shoot them down. .... ... Carl .......... . Rama-Lama-BIG-BORG ; BORG TEMPLE N.Y. Central-Park-West ; Master Builder of blessed temple KITS ; Keeper of Secret Temple Decoder Rings & Bracelets ; Fluent-in-1st--Degree--TALK-to-the-HAND --TEMPLE-ETTE--Guards--SIX--&--SEVEN-- The----WORLD--WIDE--WEB----is totally jam packed with thousands of people who are Destined to be nothing more then a faded weatherbeaten ---CHALK--OUTLINE--- along the---INFORMATION--SUPER--HIGHWAY--- This is My Main Modeling Page and Web-Site http://community.webtv.net/CYBER-BORG-4/ThemodelsIlikethe And Introducing "SPOT -the- CAT" http://community.webtv.net/CYBER-BORG-4/MODELERSHELPERall A brief look into what is really me http://community.webtv.net/CYBER-BORG-4/HeresSomeReallyBig Yessss , I'm the -real- "Bad Santa" http://community.webtv.net/CYBER-BORG-4/COMEgetYourPresent > Yesssss , I just can not begin to imagine what Stukas with cannons would > be able to do to the flight deck of an Essex class Carrier. I think it [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > ... Carl .......... I think the Stuka would have been overloaded and had a hard time getting to the target in the first place. I think that was a creative idea but impractical. How about hanging a torpedo under an Ar 240? Mount the cannon between the engines and the fuselage? Bill Banaszak, MFE Sr. >> Yesssss , I just can not begin to imagine what Stukas with cannons would >> be able to do to the flight deck of an Essex class Carrier. I think it [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > Bill Banaszak, MFE Sr. Those rocket powered guided missiles the Luftwaffe used against the Italian battleship Roma worked like a charm. Slung under a Heinkel or a Junkers bomber I believe. No ifs, ands,or buts as to how well they worked. One of those into the Douglas fir planking of an Essex class carrier could have been a sickening sight. WmB RN Hellcats over Norway apparently did mix it a bit with 109's and 190's. You might start by researching this quote: http://home.att.net/~C.C.Jordan/Grumman.html states: "Some #800 squadron Hellcats from HMS Emperor took on the German fighters and shot down 1 Fw-190 and two Bf-109G fighters. The Hellcats suffered one loss to the Luftwaffe and another to anti-aircraft fire. RN Sub/Lt. B. Richie got the Focke-Wulf and went on to total 6 kills, becoming one of only a few Royal Navy Hellcat aces." > ISTR a site or book handicapping WWII USN fighters like the Corsair, > Hellcat, Wildcat, etc, against WWII Luftwaffe fighters like the FW 190 > & Me 109, since they didn't actually meet each other in combat (or did > the RN do so?) I've googled & can't find anything. Anyone else recall > this? |
Reply to this Message |
 Sign In
 Join
 My Latest Posts My Monitored Threads My Blog My Photo Gallery My Profile My Homepage Start New Thread Enable EMail Alerts Rate this Thread
|
©2009 Advenet LLC Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.