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Are military insignia copyrighted?

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wizzzer@hotmail.com - 14 Mar 2006 15:42 GMT
How about the insignia of various American and foreign ww2 fighter and
bomber squadrons, like the flying tigers logo? Is that protected by
copyright? How about ww2 bomber nose art? Or is it all public domain?
Can I safely assume that all german ww2 / nazi insignia, symbols, and
artwork is public domain and nobody is gonna bother me for using it
commercially?
vk - 14 Mar 2006 17:22 GMT
> How about the insignia of various American and foreign ww2 fighter and
> bomber squadrons, like the flying tigers logo? Is that protected by
> copyright? How about ww2 bomber nose art? Or is it all public domain?
> Can I safely assume that all german ww2 / nazi insignia, symbols, and
> artwork is public domain and nobody is gonna bother me for using it
> commercially?

IIRC the RAF tried to copyright its roundel but the judge threw them out of
court.

I believe USAF/USN/USMC would have more luck in an US court:-))))
Richard Brooks - 14 Mar 2006 17:30 GMT
> How about the insignia of various American and foreign ww2 fighter and
> bomber squadrons, like the flying tigers logo? Is that protected by
> copyright? How about ww2 bomber nose art? Or is it all public domain?
> Can I safely assume that all german ww2 / nazi insignia, symbols, and
> artwork is public domain and nobody is gonna bother me for using it
> commercially?

I should think in the States it's not far off this which was sent to me
by the MoD in the UK.  It's even happening in the credits for films now
as there credit in the latest Wallace and Gromit credit list.

----
UNCLASSIFIED MAIL Re. Usage of RAF roundel query

Dear Mr Brooks,

Thank you for your e-mail of 26 January 2006 relating to the usage of
the RAF roundel.

The MOD has for a considerable period of time sought to protect the
reputation of the Armed Forces by controlling the use of Military
Insignia by third parties. This is particularly the case where a third
party seeks to benefit from the reputation of the armed forces for their
own commercial gain. Where appropriate this policy is achieved by the
licensing and enforcement of the MOD's intellectual property rights in
such insignia. With respect to use of the intellectual property prior to
signature of a licence, it is usual, on agreement of a licence, to
include a token payment in recognition of any prior unauthorised use.

With respect to the modelling community, there has not been any recent
change in this policy and there is no present intention to change the
policy.

Yours sincerely,

Viswan Nair

14 February 2006

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guardian6@comcast.net - 14 Mar 2006 19:22 GMT
> > How about the insignia of various American and foreign ww2 fighter and
> > bomber squadrons, like the flying tigers logo? Is that protected by
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> by the MoD in the UK.  It's even happening in the credits for films now
> as there credit in the latest Wallace and Gromit credit list.

Short answer: No, they are generally not copyright protected.

Long answer:  It depends.

Case 1:

Some nose art on US aircraft were copies of commercial art, usually
pinups
from various magazines.  That art was copyrighted, so legally a copy on

an aircraft would be an infringement, although it was probably never
enforced
during the war, and there was little likelyhood of monetary gain.  Most
common
examples would be the numerous variations of Alerto Vargas pinups taken
from
Esquire magazines and calendars.

Case 2:

Disney (Warner Brothers too) designed many unit insignia on request,
all at no
cost to the  government.  If they used a known Disney character such as
Mickey Mouse or Donald Duck, copies of those designs would probably
constitute copyright
infringement.  If the designs were done specifically for a unit and did
not involve already-existent commercial property and Disney did not
retain rights then they are probably not protected by copyright.

Case 3:

Some units had insignia with a copyrighted design, used with the
specific authorization of the design owner, for example "Snoopy"
patches.  Some of them even have a copyright symbol on them.  Those
designs are protected by copyright.

Case 4:

US national insignia - not copyrighted, but usage may be restricted by
law.  Generally the US government does not retain copyright, but it may
restrict usage via statute.  Some agencies require the approval of that
agency for use of their insignia or logo, but that may not be legally
binding - depends on the agency and the intended usage.

Case 5:

Insignia designed by government contractors where the contractor
retains copyright.
Those designs are protected by copyright.

Case 6:

There are instances of unit insignia having been copyrighted, often by
veteran's groups but also sometimes by people seeking to make a buck
off of well-known units.  These designs are protected by copyright, and
also sometimes by a trademark.

Flying Tiger insignia:  The tiger with the V device was designed by
Disney and Disney may legally have copyright - they could make an
inroad on repro designs on that one, as reproduction Flying Tiger
patches and enamel badges/pins are sold worldwide.  The shark-mouth was
used by other units prior to the AVG and is most probably not
copyrighted.

Nazi insignia - who is going to contest copyright infringement?  The
odds are if any German manufacturing firms owns the rights to a
specific design they will not contest it - bad publicity move.

One thing to remember - just because a design is ubiquitous in the
public arena and is widely reproduced without approval (like the common
"smiley face" design) doesn't mean it's in the public domain.  It's up
to a potential user to research it.

John Hairell (tpn18@yahoo.com)
Not a copyright attorney, and never played one on TV
WmB - 14 Mar 2006 20:34 GMT
<guardian6@comcast.net> wrote in message
> One thing to remember - just because a design is ubiquitous in the
> public arena and is widely reproduced without approval (like the common
> "smiley face" design) doesn't mean it's in the public domain.  It's up
> to a potential user to research it.
> Not a copyright attorney, and never played one on TV

Furthermore, if it falls into the disputed waters of trademark infringement,
I think the rules shift somewhat. For instance there is some relief  from
jeopardy if the trademark has been abandoned or not vigorously protected  -
or so I heard.  The legal eagles can correct me if  I'm wrong or expand upon
that point.

WmB
mholt@ohiohills.com - 15 Mar 2006 16:35 GMT
Where do warbird restorers get the RAF roundels?  I have the Air Corps
roundels -- the one with the red dot in the middle.  There's a source
for all the other USAF stars and bars insignia.  To me, it seems
there's a basic difference between the two services when they think
about their insignia.  But my sense of it all is that copyrighting that
sort of thing is going to be difficult.

By the way, the Target Stores logo is the same as the insignia for the
Peruvian Air
Force.
maiesm72@netscape.com - 16 Mar 2006 05:50 GMT
Target emblem is also the old Singapore insignia.

An A-4 Skyhawk is the latest jet warbird to take to the show circuit.
It's painted in Australian Navy colors to avoid being mis-identified as
a currently serving USN aircraft.

OT: There is now an ex-air tanker P2V-5 Neptune being restored to
warbird status complete with nose and tail gun turrets.

Tom
Greg Heilers - 14 Mar 2006 22:22 GMT
On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 06:42:20 -0800, wizzzer wrote:

> How about the insignia of various American and foreign ww2 fighter and
> bomber squadrons, like the flying tigers logo? Is that protected by
> copyright? How about ww2 bomber nose art? Or is it all public domain?
> Can I safely assume that all german ww2 / nazi insignia, symbols, and
> artwork is public domain and nobody is gonna bother me for using it
> commercially?

Probably the only case(s) where there *could* be a problem,
is in aircraft art, etc., that was based on copyrighted material,
such as Disney characters.  I have several books, which
stated that Mr. Disney gave "special permission" to our troops,
to use the characters on aircraft, submarine logos, etc.

Signature

Greg Heilers
Registered Linux user #328317 - SlackWare 10.2 (2.6.13)
AUS
   .....

He gets it from your side of the family, you know.  No monsters on my
side.

        -- Homer Simpson
          Treehouse of Horror II

Kevin(Bluey) - 18 Mar 2006 00:26 GMT
> How about the insignia of various American and foreign ww2 fighter and
> bomber squadrons, like the flying tigers logo? Is that protected by
> copyright? How about ww2 bomber nose art? Or is it all public domain?
> Can I safely assume that all german ww2 / nazi insignia, symbols, and
> artwork is public domain and nobody is gonna bother me for using it
> commercially?

I believe the RAAF insignia are now subject to approval from the RAAF
before they can be used other than on RAAF equipment. Hawkeye Decals is
currently the only decal company (to the best of my knowledge ) to have
official approval to use the RAAF insignia.

Signature

Kevin (Bluey)
"I'm not young enough to know everything."

bluey69@westnet.com.au

 
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