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Model Forum / General / Models / April 2006The good old days.
Was going through the garage and found some small drawer cabinets, like the ones used for screws, washers, and nuts. They contained numerous bottles of model paint that I used back in the late 70s. There must have been around 75 bottles. Most have dried up and some had caked pigment in the bottom and a syrupy fluid on top. They were Pactra and Poly-S paints. They had store price stickers on top or sides. Polly-S 5/8 fl. oz.. $.85. Pactra enamel (round bottle) .66 fl. oz. $.59. Pactra enamel (small square bottle) 1/3 fl. oz. $.39 Don't you wish?  SignatureBill In Hamptonburgh, NY To Email, remove the double zeroes after 'at' "willshak" <willshak@00hvc.rr.com> wrote in message > Don't you wish? One of my wishes came tru this weekend. I went storage room spelunking over the weekend and found a missing box of paints that went AWOL a few years ago during a mis-move. Of course it was more a case of the paints found me - I was looking for something else at the time. While I had replaced a lot of the bottles it was still a nice feeling to "unfoul" something of my own making. Solvent and paint were AOK on the ones I checked. Thank God for life's little pleasures - the big ones just don't seem to roll in as frequently. WmB (snip) > Don't you wish? My step back in time came a couple weeks ago at MosquitoCON. A vendor had a box of perhaps 200 bottles of Floquil - the good stuff from their Military Line... for $1 apiece. I bought 31 bottles (musta been thinking Baskin-Robbins) and should have bought the whole box... Frank Kranick > Was going through the garage and found some small drawer cabinets, like > the ones used for screws, washers, and nuts. They contained numerous [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > In Hamptonburgh, NY > To Email, remove the double zeroes after 'at' Especially for the Pactra paints. I've missed them ever since Testors got hold of the company. #@!%^&*+!!! Bill Banaszak, MFE Sr. >> Was going through the garage and found some small drawer cabinets, like >> the ones used for screws, washers, and nuts. They contained numerous [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > >Bill Banaszak, MFE Sr. i'm nursing 8 last bottles...you already know about my humbrol rlm. that equivalent chart that was posted helped, but i want my freakin" RLM!!!!!! i hate acrylics, and i learned how to use humbrol enamels well. damn unfair universe, bitch, grumble. > Especially for the Pactra paints. I've missed them ever > since Testors got hold of the company. #@!%^&*+!!! That makes two of us! When I heard about the Testors buy out I hustled around to the one Hobby shop in the area that handled Pactra's little bottles and bought out all the glass he had left. The plastic bottles did not hold up but the glass bottles I bought are still viable. I'm building a couple of Hasegawa Battle of Britain Hurricanes right now and the paint I'm using is Pactra. Bill Shuey > > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > Bill Shuey > What did Testor's do to the Pactra line? Didn't they just rebadge the Pactra formula? I liked Pactra because the bottle neck had the same width as the Badger airbush, and the bottle could be screwed directly onto the airbrush without dirtying up the airbrush bottle. SignatureBill In Hamptonburgh, NY To Email, remove the double zeroes after 'at' >> >> [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] >airbush, and the bottle could be screwed directly onto the airbrush >without dirtying up the airbrush bottle. i had a spare badger so i glued a bottle cap with a hole to the big round lid so i could use paint strait. > >>Especially for the Pactra paints. I've missed them ever > >>since Testors got hold of the company. #@!%^&*+!!! [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > In Hamptonburgh, NY > To Email, remove the double zeroes after 'at' Testors, or properly RPM Industries, bought out the Pactra outfit and then discontinued all the Pactra 'Namel colours. The Pactra name survives on paint for R/C Cars and, IIRC, paint for flying models. At one time here Testors paints were only available in places like Kresge's and Woolworth's. All the local hobby shops carried the Pactra line. I got started with Pactra when I discovered that for 5¢ more I could buy a bottle seemingly twice as large of better paint. I was particularly attracted to Hot Rod Primer for the cars and for the 'rubber' tires on airplanes. One could buy a big bottle of thinner for a reasonable amount. Testors had nothing to compete. They sell thinner now in bottles that hold a half of what Pactra's bottles did and they charge the same price as the big bottles went for. Then there was the Pactra liquid glue. It didn't make me sick to my stomach like Testors does to this day and worked much better. I'm still too used to glue that allows a little working time. Nothing I have today works that way. Bill Banaszak, MFE Sr. > > Especially for the Pactra paints. I've missed them ever > > since Testors got hold of the company. #@!%^&*+!!! [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Bill Shuey I didn't get that lucky. By the time Testors bought them up there was only one store that handled it and the owner got them for me especially. OTOH, I did buy up all the bottles left in the International Series. I'm not sure what to do with all that 'Suntan' that was in the group but I'll find something to use it on. Bill Banaszak, MFE Sr. Nope- you didn't figure in inflation. Suppose you were working for two bucks an hour! I did a spreadsheet for inflation using data from a government CPI site. I then looked at my old hobby mags from the forties and fifties. There are still kits very much in line with inflation compared to these years. What has happened is a broadening of the price range. There are still kits just in line with inflation, but more deluxe kits with lots more detail, and these kits are more expensive. Paints have indeed exceeded inflation. I used to pay a DIME for those small bottles. At 10X inflation they should cost a buck today. They cost nearly twice that. But at least the kits are in line with inflation. >Nope- you didn't figure in inflation. Suppose you were working for two >bucks an hour! [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >cost nearly twice that. But at least the kits are in line with >inflation. that's why i learned to revive old paint. to paraphrase everett dirkson, a bottle here and a bottle there, next thing you know, you're talking some real money. > > [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] >there, next thing you know, you're talking some real money. > Do you have any suggestions for reviving old paint? I'm loathe to throw out some of these bottles if there is a slight chance that they could be saved. Most have enough pigment to paint a couple of models if they can be resurrected into some liquid form. The Polly-Ss say to thin only with water. I put some water in one of the dry caked ones and overnight, there was no change. I wonder what that syrupy stuff was in the Polly-S bottles. In those, I was able to mix the syrup and pigment into a thickish liquid (Too thick to paint with. Needs more syrup). When I get to some hobby shop, I'll see if they have any acrylic thinner, the stuff that is used to thin paint for airbrushing. Perhaps they are too far gone. What about the Pactra enamels? Regular enamel thinner? I don't have any enamel thinner around, so I would like to know before I go out and buy some. SignatureBill In Hamptonburgh, NY To Email, remove the double zeros after 'at' >>In article <1145887225.006840.13440@y43g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>, "Don >> [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] >any enamel thinner around, so I would like to know before I go out and >buy some. i haven't worked with acrylics. if you want to send me a bottle to experiment on, i'll do it. for enamels, you need LAQUER thinner. take a piece of metal and stir up the dry stuff as finely as you can. i personally get it all out of the container and then grind it in a mortar and pestle. you want the dried stuff to be as fine as you can grind. replace in the original container and add some laquer thinner. cover the stuff to fill the container about 3/4 full. if you are working with very little powder, use less thinner. let it sit for a few days. then take an electric jig saw, tape the container to the blade, use something to hold the trigger down and shake it for a while. not crazy fast, just the same as as regular paint shaker. give it 20 minutes to 1/2 hour. let it settle and see how pasty it is. repeat the settling/shaking until it's paint again. i've done this on humbrol tins and pactra bottles. ymmv. > i haven't worked with acrylics. if you want to send me a > bottle to experiment on, i'll do it. [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > i've done this on humbrol tins and pactra bottles. > ymmv. Thanks for the suggestion. I will try this on an old bottle tonight. Bill Shuey >> i haven't worked with acrylics. if you want to send me a >> bottle to experiment on, i'll do it. [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > Bill Shuey anytime > >> i haven't worked with acrylics. if you want to send me a > >> bottle to experiment on, i'll do it. [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > anytime Don't try that with plastic bottles though. The lacquer thinner will eat its way through. Bill Banaszak, MFE Sr. >> In article <444D36F0.CF7CE359@starpower.net>, "William H. Shuey" >> [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > >Bill Banaszak, MFE Sr. oh yeah...ruined a table top. > > [quoted text clipped - 51 lines] >i haven't worked with acrylics. if you want to send me a >bottle to experiment on, i'll do it.for enamels, you need LAQUER thinner. Lacquer thinner for plastic model paint? Lacquer will eat plastic. DAMHIK. >take a piece of metal >and stir up the dry stuff as finely as you can. i personally [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] >ymmv. > SignatureBill In Hamptonburgh, NY To Email, remove the double zeroes after 'at' >>In article <124q0cmhodbvb31@news.supernews.com>, willshak >> [quoted text clipped - 76 lines] > >laquer thinner thins enamel. i've used it to thin for 40 years and never lost a kit. >>>In article <124q0cmhodbvb31@news.supernews.com>, willshak >> [quoted text clipped - 73 lines] >> >>laquer thinner thins enamel. i've used it to thin for 40 years and never lost a kit. Turpentine will also work ,and wont evaporate as fast as lacquer thinner. SignatureKevin (Bluey) "I'm not young enough to know everything." bluey69@westnet.com.au >> In article <124qjc2a5rebgdd@news.supernews.com>, willshak >> [quoted text clipped - 78 lines] > >Turpentine will also work ,and wont evaporate as fast as lacquer thinner. turpentine does not work well for reviving paint. the generic paint thinner like the walmart stuff is useless. for reviving old paint, laquer thinner works bext. i've also tried naptha, acetone, superclean, alcohol, ammonia, pikrete and baby spit. laquer thinner is the sh.t for paint resurrection. > turpentine does not work well for reviving paint. the > generic paint thinner like the walmart stuff is useless. > for reviving old paint, laquer thinner works bext. > i've also tried naptha, acetone, superclean, alcohol, > ammonia, pikrete and baby spit. > laquer thinner is the sh.t for paint resurrection. Works for me ,I've got Humbrol paints over 20 years old and I use turpentine exclusively for my enamel paints ,Never use anything else. I also bought out a hobby stores' stock of Tamiya enamels in the 10ml bottles 6 years ago some were dried out when I got them from the shop ,some still are ,all I use is turpentine to revieve them. I buy my turpentine from a paint supply shop that professional painter use. Kevin (Bluey) "I'm not young enough to know everything." bluey69@westnet.com.au >> turpentine does not work well for reviving paint. the >> generic paint thinner like the walmart stuff is useless. [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > >bluey69@westnet.com.au never got turp to revive dry humbrol. i'll try it on old pactra, though. it's about half the price of laquer thinner around here. it's just distilled pine sap, correct? >>>turpentine does not work well for reviving paint. the >>>generic paint thinner like the walmart stuff is useless. [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > around here. > it's just distilled pine sap, correct? As I understand it's made from some type of tree bark. I usually put some in the bottle with the dried paint and leave it for a day or so , to let it soak into the dry pigment. Then give it a good beating with metal rod . I generally buy the turps from where the professional painters get their supplies, rather than the supermarkert stuff. Painters use turpentine to thin and clean up their brushes after applying enamel house paints ,and I believe that hobby enamel paints are the same paint , but possibly with a finer pigment particle. I buy my matt black enamel paint in 250ml tins from the hardware store and have had no trouble using it thinned through my airbrushes. The turpentine is slower drying than lacquer or white spirit ,thinned paint which is ok in my climate as the lacquer thinned paint acts like acrylics here, dries before it gets to the intended target. I discovered there are two types of lacquer thinner as well ,the normal type lacquer thinner , and an acrylic lacquer thinner . I decanted a grey primer from a spray can meant for automotive use "Duplicolor" I think the brand name was.I used the generic enamel (lacquer) thinner to clean the container and the paint turned into a globby mess . Seems this paint is a acrylic lacquer( non aqueous acrylic) and requires the correct thinner ,leason learn't before I used it in my airbrushes , could have been messy . SignatureKevin (Bluey) "I'm not young enough to know everything." bluey69@westnet.com.au >> turpentine does not work well for reviving paint. the >> generic paint thinner like the walmart stuff is useless. [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > bluey69@westnet.com.au I just had a wierd experience with Humbrol. I brush painted an upper wing of a Fokker EV with Humbrol Olive and the damn stuff would lay down and dry. Plastic was clean, dishwashing soap and warm water, and I was using some enamel thinner, don't remember which I've got several and I'm attriting down to 1. I've never had that happen before, I'm going to try it again or just shoot it with the airbrush. Anyone have any thoughts? Frank > I just had a wierd experience with Humbrol. I brush painted an upper wing of > a Fokker EV with Humbrol Olive and the damn stuff would lay down and dry. I assume you mean "wouldn't lay down and dry" > Plastic was clean, dishwashing soap and warm water, and I was using some > enamel thinner, don't remember which I've got several and I'm attriting down > to 1. > > I've never had that happen before, I'm going to try it again or just shoot > it with the airbrush. Anyone have any thoughts? Wrong thinner, I'd guess. I had exactly the same experience after I tried thinning Revell Enamel with white spirit (I think you call it mineral spirits?) - the thinner I use for Humbrol. Not all enamel thinners are the same, and mixing them needs to be done on an experimental basis. If what you tried was using Revell enamel thinner in your Humbrol tin, then you have discovered that they don't mix :-) . Safest to thin only with the manufacturers thinner unless you already know that they are compatible - for instance I know that white spirit is compatible with Humbrol, Xtracolor and old Airfix paints, and Revell thinner is only compatible with Revell enamels and vica versa. >> I just had a wierd experience with Humbrol. I brush painted an upper >> wing of a Fokker EV with Humbrol Olive and the damn stuff would lay >> down and dry. > > I assume you mean "wouldn't lay down and dry" DOH! Ah, yes. >> Plastic was clean, dishwashing soap and warm water, and I was using >> some enamel thinner, don't remember which I've got several and I'm [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > paints, and Revell thinner is only compatible with Revell enamels and > vica versa. Yeah I think I may have used some pactra thinner I'd had out and been using with other painet. It was working well with some others so I may have just used it. Going to have to be more careful. Frank Frank, I learned early on not to use anybody else's thinner with Humbrol. They just do not work well. If you have any leftover you'll probably find it caking up into goo. Bill Banaszak, MFE Sr. > Frank, I learned early on not to use anybody else's thinner with > Humbrol. They just do not work well. If you have any leftover you'll > probably find it caking up into goo. > > Bill Banaszak, MFE Sr. Since I usually take a small amount of paint onto a pallette and then add the thinner I think I'm alright. Frank > Nope- you didn't figure in inflation. Suppose you were working > for two bucks an hour! > Paints have indeed exceeded inflation. I used to pay a DIME for those > small bottles. At 10X inflation they should cost a buck today. They > cost nearly twice that. But at least the kits are in line with > inflation. FWIW Part of the cost of paints can be laid at the door of the environmental lobby. I remember when they pulled all the little 6 packs of Humbrol off the market because of their lead content. Then there was the ruckus over Flo Quil's model railroad paints containing a "hot" solvent that was thought dangerous by some. Look at California's environmental laws! What is sold in California's hobby shops?? Bill Shuey > Nope- you didn't figure in inflation. Suppose you were working for two > bucks an hour! [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > cost nearly twice that. But at least the kits are in line with > inflation. I recall a story in "Time" back in the Nixon years. At one point the government imposed price controls and Testors raised their prices unduly. One little boy complained to the agency in charge of administering the rules. ISTR that he won. Anyone else remember this? Bill Banaszak, MFE Sr. If the enamel is still gooey, straight enamel thinner can sometimes revive it (mineral spirits). Airbrush thinner is not advised, since the paint will separate again over time. Lacquer thinner is much "hotter," as others have said. I haven't actually re-ground dried-out paint and mixed it, but I will take the other gentleman's word for it. However, thid mixture would be useful only for airbrushing, as lacquer thinner will attack plastic if it is handbrushed (which is why Floquil used to sell a barrier undercoat to use on plastics). As for the banning of the old Floquil thinner, it happened after a railroad modeler was poisoned by the stuff--he used to work in his bedroom, and inhaled an awful lot of fumes for several years, and his bone marrow was destroyed. He wrote a plaintive letter to a hobby magazine shortly before his death, and Floquil switched to a less toxic thinner. Gerald Owens > If the enamel is still gooey, straight enamel thinner can sometimes > revive it (mineral spirits). Airbrush thinner is not advised, since the [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > thinner. > Gerald Owens I remember his letter to Model Railroader. At the time I was working in an environment that had a lot more of that chemical floating in the air than I would get at home. Another comforting reason for not being there anymore. Bill Banaszak, MFE Sr. >If the enamel is still gooey, straight enamel thinner can sometimes >revive it (mineral spirits). Airbrush thinner is not advised, since the [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >thinner. >Gerald Owens i have used laquer thinner thinned paints with a brush for years. no way airbrush only. never had a problem. |
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