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Model Forum / General / Models / August 2006Strategic Air Command movie
I've just watched this movie on BBC2. Flippin' 'eck, those B-47s were nice looking jets, weren't they?  SignatureEnzo I wear the cheese. It does not wear me. > I've just watched this movie on BBC2. > > Flippin' 'eck, those B-47s were nice looking jets, weren't they? Noisy too, especially on a RATO assisted take-off! ;-) One thing I could never figure out as a kid was when they taxied why did they sound like someone driving along with the brakes on and no brake pads ? Richard. SignatureCust. - "Fine salmon in the rivers." Will Hay - "Grouse on the moors." Cust. - "Deer in the hills." Will Hay - "Ah! but cheaper in the towns!" >> I've just watched this movie on BBC2. >> >> Flippin' 'eck, those B-47s were nice looking jets, weren't they? > > Noisy too, especially on a RATO assisted take-off! ;-) They did one of those in the movie. The jet didn't hang about! The RATO gear was triggered halfway through the take-off roll and the kick in the pants that it gave the jet was very impressive indeed. SignatureEnzo I wear the cheese. It does not wear me. >>> I've just watched this movie on BBC2. >>> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > gear was triggered halfway through the take-off roll and the kick in the > pants that it gave the jet was very impressive indeed. Oh and another reason not to kick the BBC, especially BBC2 where it's not broken up either side of the news! No adverts! ;-) Richard. SignatureCust. - "Fine salmon in the rivers." Will Hay - "Grouse on the moors." Cust. - "Deer in the hills." Will Hay - "Ah! but cheaper in the towns!" >...another reason not to kick the BBC, especially BBC2 where it's >not broken up either side of the news! No adverts! ;-) Just a telly tax... SignatureAl Superczynski, MFE, IPMS/USA #3795, continuous since 1968 My "From" address is munged - use 'modeleral (at) swbell (dot) net' to respond via email. Check out my want lists and eBay listings at "Al's Place": http://home.swbell.net/arfunguy/index.html "Build what YOU like, the way YOU want to, and the critics will flame you every time." >> ...another reason not to kick the BBC, especially BBC2 where it's >> not broken up either side of the news! No adverts! ;-) > > Just a telly tax... It's not that bad especially if you try to watch a channel like ABC1 with adverts just a few minutes in from the start of a programme. Cut to buggery but a godsend to those was ADD! Richard. SignatureCust. - "Fine salmon in the rivers." Will Hay - "Grouse on the moors." Cust. - "Deer in the hills." Will Hay - "Ah! but cheaper in the towns!" > >> I've just watched this movie on BBC2. > >> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > I wear the cheese. It does not wear me. I used to know a guy who was in a B-47 wing. He said that only the first two planes off could actually see the runway in a scramble. Bill Banaszak, MFE Sr. Richard I believe the sound was a chacteristic of what I think was called a expander tube braking system which was in use back then. There are probably some out there that can tell us if the B-47 had this style of braking system. Mike > > I've just watched this movie on BBC2. > > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Cust. - "Deer in the hills." > Will Hay - "Ah! but cheaper in the towns!" > Richard > I believe the sound was a chacteristic of what I think was called a [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Mike Ahhh! Thanks for that Mike. Next question. On one of the open days at SAC Brize Norton I remember, as a kid stroking one of the tyres of a B-47 and getting stabbed by a thin hard piece of steel wire then noticing that there were many of them sticking out. My brother (who then went on to serve with the USAF in Vietnam) told me after asking one of the serving men, that it was something to do with static drain. Is this true or was it to reduce wear and tear ? Richard. SignatureCust. - "Fine salmon in the rivers." Will Hay - "Grouse on the moors." Cust. - "Deer in the hills." Will Hay - "Ah! but cheaper in the towns!" There's the noise, but what about the filth? I remember that movie and the planes taking off left a lot of soot behind them. It was pretty impressive. B52's did that too, but more so! --- Stephen > There's the noise, but what about the filth? I remember that movie and > the planes taking off left a lot of soot behind them. It was pretty > impressive. B52's did that too, but more so! > > --- Stephen I suppose we were used to it as kids! In the UK with smog, it was possible to play a game of hide-and-seek whereby you could stand maybe three feet away from your mate and not be seen, so a B-47 taking off was not as bad, even with the wind blowing towards you. Richard. SignatureCust. - "Fine salmon in the rivers." Will Hay - "Grouse on the moors." Cust. - "Deer in the hills." Will Hay - "Ah! but cheaper in the towns!" The early models of the B-52 used water injection on takeoff. That added thrust and soot. Water takeoffs were always a kick in the butt. The worst part was when the water ran out and the plane lost that added thrust. It could be quite a jolt if your pilot didn't react quickly enough. Jim Williams B-52 Instructor Radar Navigator >The early models of the B-52 used water injection on takeoff. That added >thrust and soot. Water takeoffs were always a kick in the butt. The worst [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >Jim Williams >B-52 Instructor Radar Navigator what, water? please explain that to me. i understand the german mw50 ethanol but water in a jet? it seems crazy. >>The early models of the B-52 used water injection on takeoff. That added >>thrust and soot. Water takeoffs were always a kick in the butt. The worst >>part was when the water ran out and the plane lost that added thrust. It >>could be quite a jolt if your pilot didn't react quickly enough. >what, water? please explain that to me. i understand the >german mw50 ethanol but water in a jet? it seems crazy. <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_injection_%28engines%29> SignatureAl Superczynski, MFE, IPMS/USA #3795, continuous since 1968 My "From" address is munged - use 'modeleral (at) swbell (dot) net' to respond via email. Check out my want lists and eBay listings at "Al's Place": http://home.swbell.net/arfunguy/index.html "Build what YOU like, the way YOU want to, and the critics will flame you every time." >>>The early models of the B-52 used water injection on takeoff. That added >>>thrust and soot. Water takeoffs were always a kick in the butt. The worst [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > ><http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_injection_%28engines%29> doh! thanks al. >>The early models of the B-52 used water injection on takeoff. That added >>thrust and soot. Water takeoffs were always a kick in the butt. The worst >>part was when the water ran out and the plane lost that added thrust. It >>could be quite a jolt if your pilot didn't react quickly enough. > what, water? please explain that to me. i understand the > german mw50 ethanol but water in a jet? it seems crazy. http://roger.ecn.purdue.edu/~propulsi/propulsion/jets/basics/water.html Cheers, >> In article <79Tyg.45485$u11.40706@tornado.ohiordc.rr.com>, "Jim Williams" >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > >Cheers, thanks >> The early models of the B-52 used water injection on takeoff. That added >> thrust and soot. Water takeoffs were always a kick in the butt. The worst [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > what, water? please explain that to me. i understand the > german mw50 ethanol but water in a jet? it seems crazy. Ever tried throwing water on paraffin or petrol as a kid ? ;-) Richard. SignatureCust. - "Fine salmon in the rivers." Will Hay - "Grouse on the moors." Cust. - "Deer in the hills." Will Hay - "Ah! but cheaper in the towns!" >> In article <79Tyg.45485$u11.40706@tornado.ohiordc.rr.com>, "Jim Williams" >>> The early models of the B-52 used water injection on takeoff. That added [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > >Richard. no, i was a black powder and fireworks fan >>> In article <79Tyg.45485$u11.40706@tornado.ohiordc.rr.com>, "Jim Williams" >>>> The early models of the B-52 used water injection on takeoff. That added [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > no, i was a black powder and fireworks fan But that's not water injection. Try it sometime but don't do as we did, trying it indoors! Later I was an Irish firework mixture fan but after a rocket mishap and seeing the windows bow inwards with the explosion, the residents from the length of the street standing outside and the near deaf next door neighbour telling me that he thought there was a plane crash, I retired. Richard. SignatureCust. - "Fine salmon in the rivers." Will Hay - "Grouse on the moors." Cust. - "Deer in the hills." Will Hay - "Ah! but cheaper in the towns!" >> The early models of the B-52 used water injection on takeoff. That >> added thrust and soot. Water takeoffs were always a kick in the [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > what, water? please explain that to me. i understand the > german mw50 ethanol but water in a jet? it seems crazy. Harriers use demineralised water injection as well. The water is sprayed into the jet engine compressor turbines and serves to cool the air and so increase its density. SignatureEnzo I wear the cheese. It does not wear me. > Next question. On one of the open days at SAC Brize Norton I remember, > as a kid stroking one of the tyres of a B-47 and getting stabbed by a > thin hard piece of steel wire then noticing that there were many of them > sticking out. That sounds an awful lot like the woven steel cables wearing out of the rubber compound rather than any kind of anti-static device. Those are more often found on the wing and empennage tips where they can dissipate the static while in flight. It *could* have had something to do with grounding the aircraft, but rubber makes a pretty darned good insulator, and I wouldn't depend on anything short of a proper grounding cable. I think that serviceman was spinning a yarn for your brother. SignatureJessica >> Next question. On one of the open days at SAC Brize Norton I remember, >> as a kid stroking one of the tyres of a B-47 and getting stabbed by a [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > wouldn't depend on anything short of a proper grounding cable. I think > that serviceman was spinning a yarn for your brother. Well, he bought it but got a deserved kicking up the arse of reality on camp whilst in service in the States. He was spotted dropping a cigarette end and had to wrap the cigarette in newspaper, dig a hole 6 foot cubed then place the newspaper in the middle, fill the hole in then dig it out again. That'll teach him to get taken in! :-) Anyway, Strategic Air Command - great film and to hell with the companies who won't put these classics on DVD. Richard. SignatureCust. - "Fine salmon in the rivers." Will Hay - "Grouse on the moors." Cust. - "Deer in the hills." Will Hay - "Ah! but cheaper in the towns!" My Dad was a Crew Chief on B-47, so I asked him. Here is his answer. HI SON; The aircraft was equiped with the old expander tube type brake with was famous for it sound. The C-124 used the same type brake and they were much worse than the B-47. An expander tube is just what it sounds like, one tube that expands the push the pads out to make contact with the brake drum. They are slow to release that caused the sound. I hope this answard your question. So, that is one mystery solved. >My Dad was a Crew Chief on B-47, so I asked him. Here is his answer. > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >So, that is one mystery solved. wish i could find a diagram... > wish i could find a diagram... I don't know if this helps, but here is a pdf from Crane Aerospace with schematics of what they describe as the current incarnation of the braking system designed for the B-47. http://www.craneae.com/Solutions/Landing/downloads/MilitarySystems.pdf They also provide a link to ask questions and some links to additional braking system information. They may be able to provide you with the diagram you want. http://www.craneae.com/Solutions/Landing/brake_control.htm >> wish i could find a diagram... > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >diagram you want. >http://www.craneae.com/Solutions/Landing/brake_control.htm that did it quite well, actually. now if i can find a photo, i will have everything. thank you very much! > They also provide a link to ask questions and some links to additional > braking system information. They may be able to provide you with the > diagram you want. > http://www.craneae.com/Solutions/Landing/brake_control.htm I thought one of the coolest shot's in the movie was in the beginning from the tower where you could see the B-45 Tornado's on the ramp. Not a common sight! Pugs > >My Dad was a Crew Chief on B-47, so I asked him. Here is his answer. > > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > > wish i could find a diagram... Not a diagram, but this should help: http://warbirdinformationexchange.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=8213&highlight=b36 There is a photo there of the B-36 with the main gear retracted with no wheels installed. The wheels would have a brake drum installed, the pads were on the brake assembly. >> In article <L7Tyg.38662$vl5.23934@tornado.ohiordc.rr.com>, "Jim Williams" >> [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] >wheels installed. The wheels would have a brake drum installed, the >pads were on the brake assembly. thank you. just mostly what i need. and damn, why did i sell my 1/72 kit? all you ever wanted to know about the b-36 interior. i suspect those pictures were taken by a modeler who knows how to drive a camera. truhtfully, i don't even have ceiling space for the monster. that is an awful lot of brake pads. must have been a nightmare to do a brake job. happily now i can visualize how the brakes work. they must sound like a giants bus when they blow up the tubes. but now i'm haunted with the idea of sitting in a b-36 going down the runway with 6 churning and 4 burning. too bad there isn't a flyer left but i can't even imagine what a logistic nightmare that would be for a private organization. > My Dad was a Crew Chief on B-47, so I asked him. Here is his answer. > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > So, that is one mystery solved. Thanks very much for that! To simulate the sound take a couple of pieces of expanded polystyrene, lick them then find a hypermarket window near a line of checkouts and rub the polystyrene slowly around the glass. Watch the lines of customers writhe in agony! Richard. SignatureCust. - "Fine salmon in the rivers." Will Hay - "Grouse on the moors." Cust. - "Deer in the hills." Will Hay - "Ah! but cheaper in the towns!" |
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