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Model Forum / General / Railroads / July 2005Anti-Americanism & The World
Mexican fans took up the chant "Osama! Osama!" during a recent US-Canada Olympic soccer game held south of our border. Last month, protesters in Athens chanted "Sept. 11 every day!" during an anti-American rally. American chief executive of the financial services firm Swift and president of the American Chamber of Commerce in Belgium, took a seat next to an elegant woman he recognized as one of Belgium's richest people. During the pre-dinner chitchat in a room full of museum-quality contemporary art, she ventured offhandedly that it was "good that the Americans got hit on Sept. 11. Maybe it taught them a lesson." "She was just repeating what she had heard," he says. "The real point is that 90% of the people she talks to every day would agree with her." Philadelphia transplant Susan Steele, head of Forum management company in London, has noticed that many Europeans have started using the phrase "that's American," which is shorthand, Steele says, for "not taking anyone else into consideration." Three-time gold medalist Karch Kiraly shared his volleyball war stories with some of the current crop of American Olympians. He described being pelted with ice cubes, raw eggs, tomatoes and D-cell batteries while playing in Argentina. In Brazil, assaults on the Americans came from spitting fans perched above the court's exit. In Britain, the United States' staunchest friend, snide remarks and downright animosity greet many Americans these days. It's not just religious radicals and terrorists who resent the United States anymore. Leading up to the Iraq war,millions of protestors took to the streets throughout Italy to protest the planned invasion.One reporter asked a protestor in Rome why he was protesting and he replied "Bush is the new Hitler and America is the new Nazi Germany and Iraq is the new Poland.They all deserve more 9/11s!Our premier is the new Mussolini and he should get what Mussolini got!" "Why do people attack Americans?" asks Tiny Waslandek, a social worker in Amsterdam, Netherlands. "Because they have a big, big mouth and they mind everybody's business." "Around the world, from Western Europe to the Far East, many see the United States as arrogant, hypocritical, self-absorbed,self-indulgent and contemptuous of others," Peterson says. "This is not a Muslim country issue. It has metastasized to the rest of the world and includes some of our closest European allies." New Yorker Julia Magnet, a journalist who just moved to London, found that out when she decided to throw a Fourth of July party for British friends. Between grilled sausages and chocolate cake, her friends launched an attack on Bush and the United States. They called Bush a "homicidal maniac" and "stupid" and the United States the "world's biggest terrorist." A road trip for a group of U.S. peewee hockey players to a tournament in Montreal turned into a foray into enemy territory as the boys were barraged with anti-American insults and witnessed protesters trashing the American flag, reports the Globe and Mail. Americans watched as a crowd cheered when a protester waved the Iraqi flag, and booed the U.S. flag. Next, the Stars and Stripes were doused with kerosene and ignited. "It went up in a puff of smoke and flames, and the crowd went wild. They were all cheering,""They told us we s----, gave us the finger and said 'Down with the U.S.A.' or 'The U.S.A. s----," "People hate you. Everyone hates you. The whole world hates you." The pretty middle-aged woman, a Swiss mother and scholar, at the dinner table in Geneva earnestly wants to make that perfectly clear.She isn't angry with me. She thinks the American people are totally ignorant, misled by the media and a criminal president. I was traveling on a London bus when a well-dressed woman boarded with her equally-respectable son in his school uniform. Ahead of her was an elderly American woman, who said, 'I beg your pardon, I didn't mean to bang into you.' This prompted a tirade from the Englishwoman -- let's call her Lady E -- that resembled a verbal assault by a brownshirt against a hapless Jewish pedestrian in 1933. The American -- call her Mrs. A -- sat down and cowered as the tirade continued: 'I rejoice every time I hear of another American soldier dying! You people all deserve to die in another 9/11. You are destroying the world.' Mrs A fought back: 'I personally am NOT destroying the world.' This only provoked Lady E more, and as the bus driver and passengers laughed, she screamed into the American's face 'I wish every one of you would leave this country and not set foot in it ever again,' and Mrs A began to wince, crying. 'Thank you for ruining my day and my trip.' At this point Lady E lunged at the American and began to shake her. I jumped up and shouted at the top of my voice for the driver to stop and for her to leave the woman alone, prompting Lady E to come over to me and grab me. 'Another bloody American accent! You come here and think you can strut about, well, you are scum.' Thankfully, the woman next to me pushed her away. I left the bus as the American woman sat sobbing. A few weeks before, I had attended a party at which I was lambasted, intimidated and mocked by a group of people I had known for some twenty-odd years. It reminded me of a comment made to me by an American expatriate shortly after 9/11: 'Now I know what the Jews felt like in pre-war Germany.' During the tea break I asked a man at one of the booths for a leaflet. Instead of welcoming me and asking for a donation, he had detected my accent and duly launched into a loud and red-faced screeching session about the evils of the American Empire and of the 'Naziism' and 'Fascism' promulgated by the United States. A black man came over and began shouting about America having 'invented slavery' and soon a delicate elderly lady joined the fray to bellow about the Zionists running America (did she mean Robert Rubin, Dennis Ross, Sandy Berger -- after all, it was the pre-Wolfowitz/Perle time zone) and the 'genocides' perpetrated by Americans since the days of William Penn."You Yanks should look at yourselves in the mirror and wonder why every so often there is a Holocaust or massacre or pogrom. You bring it on yourselves. Just look at the way you are and then figure out why the rest of the world wants to flatten you." The English are not known for public displays of fury except perhaps at soccer matches, but there is something about an American accent that brings out their pent-up rage. Many Americans are leaving their homes abroad and returning home after decades in foreign countries. Notwithstanding the loss of free medical care and pills (and that is one hell of a sacrifice!) afforded by their adopted countries, they can no longer endure the daily abuse and the ugly posters and stickers that proliferate across European cities. When the many anti-war rallies were held in February 2003 young people in European cities were seen wearing headbands with slogans wishing death upon Jews and Israel. America now faces "the sorrows of empire": a state of perpetual war, soon with weapons of mass destruction; the end of constitutional democracy, with a Pentagonised presidency; and the bankruptcy of the US economy.US imperial ambitions are designed to overcome the inherent failures and contradictions of the American economy.Bush's open-ended claims for US power--including the unilateral right to invade and occupy "failed states" to execute "regime change"--offend international law and are prerogatives associated only with empire. But Bush's greater vulnerability is about money. You can't sustain an empire from a debtor's weakening position--sooner or later the creditors pull the plug. That humiliating lesson was learned by Great Britain early in the last century, and the United States faces a similar reckoning ahead. > Mexican fans took up the chant "Osama! Osama!" during a recent > US-Canada Olympic soccer game held south of our border. Last month, > protesters in Athens chanted "Sept. 11 every day!" during an > anti-American rally. [crap snip] Has not the others figured this out yet? We americans ARE the world with all the others trying to catch up. As parents, we need to align kids ( our own AND the neighbors ) to our beliefs and ways of doing thing as they are playing in OUR sandbox. Get a grip, most of the third world coutries would not exist if it wasn't for the money sent and spent in those countries. Payback? We haven't seen any payback since before WWI, let alone any of the others. As far as this American is concerned, we can put up our walls again, and NOT deal with anybody outside them. Might as well turn it all into sand and glass, then make parking lots out of what is left. No more aliens crossing into our country, no more political asylum, no more! If you don't like it, leave. > > Mexican fans took up the chant "Osama! Osama!" during a recent > > US-Canada Olympic soccer game held south of our border. Last month, [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > crossing into our country, no more political asylum, no more! If you > don't like it, leave. Most Americans feel the same, however, most US Corporations do not, so batten down your hatches, third world here we come! >> > Mexican fans took up the chant "Osama! Osama!" during a recent >> > US-Canada Olympic soccer game held south of our border. Last month, [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] >Most Americans feel the same, however, most US Corporations do >not, so batten down your hatches, third world here we come! Only in dumbfuckistan. http://www.projectsomewhere.com/gal-4595,10623,5506.html "What is freedom of expression? Without the freedom to offend, it ceases to exist " -Salman Rushdie "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." -Martin Luther King "A gentleman is a man who can disagree without being disagreeable." Anon "Revolution in Politics is an abrupt change in the form of misgovernment." Ambrose Bierce "I don't make jokes. I just watch the government and report the facts" - Mark Twain >> As far as this American is concerned, we can put up our walls again, and >> NOT deal with anybody outside them. Might as well turn it all into sand [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >Most Americans feel the same, however, most US Corporations do >not, so batten down your hatches, third world here we come! Which is why nothing is going to significantly change just because our European and Canadian friends have their collective shorts in a bunch about Iraq. None of them can remotely afford to quit doing business with the U.S., by far the world's largest economy. And the U.S. knows it. Don't hold your breath waiting for the U.S. to take on third world status. Brian : Most Americans feel the same, however, most US Corporations do : not, so batten down your hatches, third world here we come! http://www.vdare.com/roberts/050603_labor.htm VDARE.com: 06/03/05 - US Labor Force: One Foot in the Third World "US Labor Force: One Foot in the Third World By Paul Craig Roberts In May the Bush economy eked out a paltry 73,000 private sector jobs: 20,000 jobs in construction (primarily for Mexican immigrants), 21,000 jobs in wholesale and retail trade, and 32,500 jobs in health care and social assistance. Local government added 5,000 for a grand total of 78,000. Not a single one of these jobs produces an exportable good or service. With Americans increasingly divorced from the production of the goods and services that they consume, Americans have no way to pay for their consumption except by handing over to foreigners more of their accumulated stock of wealth. The country continues to eat its seed corn. Only 10 million Americans are classified as "production workers" in the Bureau of Labor Statistics nonfarm payroll tables. Think about that. The US with a population approaching 300 million has only 10 million production workers. That means Americans are consuming the products of other countries labor. In the 21^st century the US economy has been unable to create jobs in export and import-competitive industries. US job growth is confined to nontradable domestic services. This movement of the American labor force toward third world occupations in domestic services has dire implications both for US living standards and for America's status as a superpower. Economists and policymakers are in denial while the US economy implodes in front of their noses. The US-China Commission is making a great effort to bring reality to policymakers by holding a series of hearings to explore the depths of American decline. The commissioners got an earful at the May 19 hearings in New York at the Council on Foreign Relations. Ralph Gomory explained that America's naïve belief that offshore outsourcing and globalism are working for America is based on a 200 year old trade theory, the premises of which do not reflect the modern world. Clyde Prestowitz, author of the just published Three Billion New Capitalists: The Great Shift of Wealth and Power to the East, explained that America's prosperity is an illusion. Americans feel prosperous because they are consuming $700 billion annually more than they are producing. Foreigners, principally Asians, are financing US over-consumption, because we are paying them by handing over our markets, our jobs, and our wealth. My former Business Week colleague, Bill Wolman, explained the consequences for US workers of suddenly facing direct labor market competition from hundreds of millions of Chinese and Indian workers. Toward the end of the 20^th century three developments came together that are rapidly moving high productivity, high value-added jobs that pay well away from the US to Asia: the collapse of world socialism which vastly increased the supply of labor available to US capital; the rise of the high speed Internet; the extraordinary international mobility of US capital and technology. First world capital is rapidly deserting first world labor in favor of third world labor, which is much cheaper because of its abundance and low cost of living. Formerly, America's high real incomes were protected from cheap foreign labor, because US labor worked with more capital and better technology, which made it more productive. Today, however, US capital and technology move to cheap labor, or cheap labor moves via the Internet to US employment. The reason economic development in China and some Indian cities is so rapid is because it is fueled by the offshore location of first world corporations. Prestowitz is correct that the form that globalism has taken is shifting income and wealth from the first world to the third world. The rise of Asia is coming at the expense of the American worker. Global competition could have developed differently. US capital and technology could have remained at home, protecting US incomes with high productivity. Asia would have had to raise itself up without the inside track of first world offshore producers. Asia's economic development would have been slow and laborious and would have been characterized by a gradual rise of Asian incomes toward US incomes, not by a jarring loss of American jobs and incomes to Asians. Instead, US corporations, driven by the short-sighted and ultimately destructive focus on quarterly profits, chose to drive earnings and managerial bonuses by substituting cheap Asian labor for American labor. American businesses' short-run profit maximization plays directly into the hands of thoughtful Asian governments with long-run strategies. As Prestowitz informed the commissioners, China now has more semiconductor plants than the US. Short-run goals are reducing US corporations to brand names with sales forces marketing foreign made goods and services. By substituting foreign for American workers, US corporations are destroying their American markets. As American jobs in the higher paying manufacturing and professional services are given to Asians, and as American schoolteachers and nurses lose their occupations to foreigners imported under work visa programs, American purchasing power dries up, especially once all the home equity is spent, credit cards are maxed out and the dollar loses value to the Asian currencies. The dollar is receiving a short-term respite as a result of the rejection of the European Union by France and Holland. The fate of the Euro, which rose so rapidly in value against the dollar in recent years, is uncertain, thus possibly cutting off one avenue of escape from the over-produced US dollar. However, nothing is in the works to halt America's decline and to put the economy on a path of true prosperity. In January 2004, I told a televised conference of the Brookings Institution in Washington, DC, that the US would be a third world economy in 20 years. I was projecting the economic outcome of the US labor force being denied first world employment and forced into the low productivity occupations of domestic services. Considering the vast excess supplies of labor in India and China, Asian wages are unlikely to rapidly approach existing US levels. Therefore, the substitution of Asian for US labor in tradable goods and services is likely to continue. As US students seek employments immune from outsourcing, engineering enrollments are declining. The exit of so much manufacturing is destroying the supply chains that make manufacturing possible. The Asians will not give us back our economy once we have lost it. They will not play the "free trade" game and let their labor force be displaced by cheap American labor. Offshore outsourcing is dismantling the ladders of America's fabled upward mobility. The US labor force already has one foot in the third world. By 2024 the US will be a has-been country." For most workers in the U.S., there will be precious little to spend for hobbies like model railroading. --Jerry Leslie Note: leslie@jrlvax.houston.rr.com is invalid for email Has WHAT to do with guns, FUCKTARD? And the one thing they still keep making here in the U.S. is the thing they have always been clueless at: automibile manufacturing. On 7/1/05 9:39 AM, in article 1120228786.082741.147040@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com, "rst" <senninha@ziplip.com> wrote: > And the one thing they still keep making here in the U.S. is the thing > they have always been clueless at: automibile manufacturing. That's right. Nobody can make an automibile like we can! Whatever an automibile is, anyway.  SignatureBrian Ehni > > Mexican fans took up the chant "Osama! Osama!" during a recent > > US-Canada Olympic soccer game held south of our border. Last month, [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > crossing into our country, no more political asylum, no more! If you > don't like it, leave. Please do put up your walls! > > Mexican fans took up the chant "Osama! Osama!" during a recent > > US-Canada Olympic soccer game held south of our border. Last month, [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > crossing into our country, no more political asylum, no more! If you > don't like it, leave. heehee....... a fat illiterate sleazy violent society with a 40 trillion debtridden big mac service economy that owes 7 trillion to the world and where theres over 10000 terrorists with their suitcase nukes and viral cropdusters waiting hardly has any hope for even its existence on the earth. the american social experiment and genetic experiment of the world's rejects and refuse shall be incinerated like a trash dump. and the world will watch and celebrate! > a fat illiterate sleazy violent society with a 40 trillion debtridden > big mac service economy that owes 7 trillion to the world and where So we are like the rest of the world? > theres over 10000 terrorists with their suitcase nukes and viral > cropdusters waiting hardly has any hope for even its existence on the > earth. Please, that would mean that they would have to stop killing each other. LOL, We all know that isn't going to happen. > the american social experiment and genetic experiment of the world's > rejects and refuse shall be incinerated like a trash dump. LOL, your funny. > and the world will watch and celebrate! Until they learn that they are next. Wahahahahahahahahahahaha > > Mexican fans took up the chant "Osama! Osama!" during a recent > > US-Canada Olympic soccer game held south of our border. Last month, [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Has not the others figured this out yet? We americans ARE the world > with all the others trying to catch up. I think one major reason a lot of people around the world have hated the US for decades is simple jealousy, that it was primarily white Americans of Western European descent who invented most of the technology and advances the world freely uses and it makes much of the rest of the world look stupid as they've been around a lot longer than the United States. They think we need to be taken down a notch as the rest of the world hasn't kept up with the pace of the US in creating new things that improve the quality of life of people all over the world. They're upset that an African didn't get to invent the automobile, and a Middle Easterner didn't get to invent the airplane, and a Filipino didn't create the Polio Vaccine, and a Greek didn't get to invent the telephone, and it somehow isn't fair that Bill Gates got to create Windows instead of somebody from the third world. > > > Mexican fans took up the chant "Osama! Osama!" during a recent > > > US-Canada Olympic soccer game held south of our border. Last month, [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > to invent the telephone, and it somehow isn't fair that Bill Gates got > to create Windows instead of somebody from the third world. That last one is nothing to be proud of. :) > > I think one major reason a lot of people around the world have hated [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > new things that improve the quality of life of people all over the > world. A major reason that "a lot of people around the world have hated the US for decades", as you put it, is the arrogance and ignorance displayed by many US citizens. Your post is a good example of this. "White Americans of Western European descent" have never had a monopoly on inventions, the development of technology, or improving quality of life. > They're upset that an African didn't get to invent the > automobile, Neither did an American. > and a Middle Easterner didn't get to invent the airplane, Neither did an American. > and a Greek didn't get to invent the telephone, No, and Alexander Grahame Bell did not "invent" electricity, electromagnetism, or any of the other dozen or so technologies needed to make telephony practical. Technologies that were all the product of people from the rest of the world, you know, the ones who "look stupid as they've been around a lot longer than the United States"... > and it somehow isn't fair that Bill Gates got to create Windows > instead of somebody from the third world. You have a strange idea of what's fair, if you regard the "invention" of Windows as a good thing... On 6/28/05 7:18 PM, in article 42C1E8CC.3000908@optusnet.com.au, >> >> and a Middle Easterner didn't get to invent the airplane, > > Neither did an American. Here we go again. Who is it this time? Alberto Santos-Dumont or the Richard Pearse guy you trundle out every now and then. No one gives either one any credence. SignatureBrian Ehni > On 6/28/05 7:18 PM, in article 42C1E8CC.3000908@optusnet.com.au, > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > Pearse guy you trundle out every now and then. No one gives either one any > credence. Of course you don't, you're too arrogant to consider that anyone but a yank got there first. There were at least 6 individals working separately to build practical aircraft around 1900-1905. The Wrights built a powered glider which required a catapult to launch. Richard Pearse built an entirely self powered aircraft which successfully flew numerous times from March 1903, including figure "8"s but he did not consider that he had built a practical flying machine because it would not continue flying for more than a couple of miles. (a replica motor built from some parts of the original and to the original drawings runs for around 45 seconds before losing power) Regards, Greg.P. >> On 6/28/05 7:18 PM, in article 42C1E8CC.3000908@optusnet.com.au, >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > got > there first. And you're too busy America bashing to bother to get any of your facts right. > There were at least 6 individals working separately to build practical > aircraft > around 1900-1905. > The Wrights built a powered glider which required a catapult to launch. A catapult???? Hardly. You realize of course that the Wright catapult was a LATER invention, and not in use at Kitty Hawk? > Richard Pearse built an entirely self powered aircraft which successfully flew > numerous times from March 1903, Something which is claimed by others, but he himself denied. > including figure "8"s Not in any account of his early flight -- he supposedly took off in a straight line and made a 50 yard uncontrolled flight into a fence or hedge. Any figure 8s would have came years later -- if they came at all. I see no evidence he ever made anything but a straight uncontrolled hop; not a true flight in any sense of the word, which is what he claimed as well. but he did not consider > that he had built a practical flying machine because it would not continue > flying for more than a couple of miles. He also says himself that he didn't beat the Wright brothers. There are no eyewitness accounts of his first flight, which he said was in 1904. Other people now claim it happened a year or two earlier. With no witnesses or accounts to back it up, and against the written record of Pearse himself! > (a replica motor built from some parts of the original and to the original > drawings runs for around 45 seconds before losing power) Think how fast he'd have to be going to cover 'a couple of miles' in 45 seconds. > Regards, > Greg.P. Both Pearse and Santos-Dumont, by all reasonable accounts, started working on their 'airplanes' in 1904, after the news of Kitty hawked reached them. > >> On 6/28/05 7:18 PM, in article 42C1E8CC.3000908@optusnet.com.au, > >> [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > And you're too busy America bashing to bother to get any of your facts > right. America bashing? I commented on the US's actions, not the two continents which constitute America. > > There were at least 6 individals working separately to build practical > > aircraft [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > A catapult???? Hardly. You realize of course that the Wright catapult was > a LATER invention, and not in use at Kitty Hawk? I guess they were desperate to show some clearance between their plane and the ground? > > Richard Pearse built an entirely self powered aircraft which successfully flew > > numerous times from March 1903, > > Something which is claimed by others, but he himself denied. No, he did not deny it. > > including figure "8"s > > Not in any account of his early flight -- he supposedly took off in a > straight line and made a 50 yard uncontrolled flight into a fence or hedge. Go back and read the book again - he flew from a paddock surrounded by 10 foot plus high hedges, over a river bed which was several hundred feet below the field, turned 180 degrees, recrossed the hedge and crashed onto the hedge at the side of the field. In fact he made numerous (test) flights which were observed by a number of people, the one you appear to be refering to was made from a flat road between similar hedges to the one above. > Any figure 8s would have came years later -- if they came at all. I see no > evidence he ever made anything but a straight uncontrolled hop; not a true > flight in any sense of the word, which is what he claimed as well. So the Wrights didn't fly in 1903 - fair point. > but he did not consider > > that he had built a practical flying machine because it would not continue [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > people now claim it happened a year or two earlier. With no witnesses or > accounts to back it up, and against the written record of Pearse himself! The 1903 date comes from an eye witness who saw the Pearse plane flying with snow on the ground - meteorological records (yes, we were ahead on that point too) show that it could only have been 1902 or 1903. 1904 was snow free in that region. In spite of Pearse making his tests in secret there were a number of witnesses to his flights or the results of them. > > (a replica motor built from some parts of the original and to the original > > drawings runs for around 45 seconds before losing power) > > Think how fast he'd have to be going to cover 'a couple of miles' in 45 > seconds. Even an ignoramus like you can figure that maximum power is required for takeoff and reduced power for continued flight. > > Regards, > > Greg.P. > > Both Pearse and Santos-Dumont, by all reasonable accounts, started working > on their 'airplanes' in 1904, after the news of Kitty hawked reached them. Crap - Richard Pearse worked for 3-4 years to build his motor and aeroplane - that would put his flight in 1906-8. >>>> On 6/28/05 7:18 PM, in article 42C1E8CC.3000908@optusnet.com.au, >>>> [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > America bashing? I commented on the US's actions, not the two continents which > constitute America. Yawn >>> There were at least 6 individals working separately to build practical >>> aircraft [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > I guess they were desperate to show some clearance between their plane and the > ground? They were compensating for launches in places less windy than Kitty Hawk. >>> Richard Pearse built an entirely self powered aircraft which successfully >>> flew [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > No, he did not deny it. He wrote letters that said it happened long after the Wright brothers. >>> including figure "8"s >> [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > the one you appear to be refering to was made from a flat road between similar > hedges to the one above. You're reading from a different source than I am. >> Any figure 8s would have came years later -- if they came at all. I see no >> evidence he ever made anything but a straight uncontrolled hop; not a true [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > takeoff and > reduced power for continued flight. And it proves you to be wrong, as does every other source. >>> Regards, >>> Greg.P. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > that > would put his flight in 1906-8. Pearse HIMSELF says he started in 1904. > >>>> On 6/28/05 7:18 PM, in article 42C1E8CC.3000908@optusnet.com.au, > >>>> [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > > They were compensating for launches in places less windy than Kitty Hawk. Pearse took of from paddocks surrounded by hedges specifically placed there as wind breaks. > >>> Richard Pearse built an entirely self powered aircraft which successfully > >>> flew [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > He wrote letters that said it happened long after the Wright brothers. Sure, and the facts don't match his letters. Richard Pearse's last flights were curtailed by bankruptcy and a move of several hundred miles, which did not include his aircraft which was a part of the bankruptcy sale. That precisely rules out any flying activity after 1903 because the bankruptcy is both official and public record. Richard Pearse was _wrong_ about the timing when he wrote his letters. > >>> including figure "8"s > >> [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > You're reading from a different source than I am. There have AFAIK been three books written on the subject. Between the authors I would be fairly sure that all the facts that are likey to emerge have been brought out. > >> Any figure 8s would have came years later -- if they came at all. I see no > >> evidence he ever made anything but a straight uncontrolled hop; not a true [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > > And it proves you to be wrong, as does every other source. What proves me to be wrong? How? Maximum power is _only_ required for takeoff. > >>> Regards, > >>> Greg.P. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > > Pearse HIMSELF says he started in 1904. Certainly, but at that time he was bankrupt (public record) and no longer had access to his land and aircraft. He was wrong! On 6/29/05 6:15 PM, in article 42C32BAF.FE53333F@ihug.co.nz, "Greg Procter" <Procter@ihug.co.nz> wrote: >> He wrote letters that said it happened long after the Wright brothers. > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > is both official and public record. > Richard Pearse was _wrong_ about the timing when he wrote his letters. And who would know better about when he did it than himself? Get real, Greg. SignatureBrian Ehni > On 6/29/05 6:15 PM, in article 42C32BAF.FE53333F@ihug.co.nz, "Greg Procter" > <Procter@ihug.co.nz> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > And who would know better about when he did it than himself? Get real, Greg. The registry of bankruptcy Court. > -- > Brian Ehni On 6/29/05 6:50 PM, in article 42C333CE.938EB19B@ihug.co.nz, "Greg Procter" <Procter@ihug.co.nz> wrote: >> On 6/29/05 6:15 PM, in article 42C32BAF.FE53333F@ihug.co.nz, "Greg Procter" >> <Procter@ihug.co.nz> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] >> -- >> Brian Ehni Nice try. He made the statements that he had not achieved controlled flight in the 1915 timeframe. I find no reference to his bankruptcy, even in the official biography located at http://www.dnzb.govt.nz/dnzb/ Perhaps you can elucidate? SignatureBrian Ehni > On 6/29/05 6:50 PM, in article 42C333CE.938EB19B@ihug.co.nz, "Greg Procter" > <Procter@ihug.co.nz> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > > Perhaps you can elucidate? I'd have to find the book, which is buried somewhere in a pile of cartons from my last move. > -- > Brian Ehni >>>>>> On 6/28/05 7:18 PM, in article 42C1E8CC.3000908@optusnet.com.au, >>>>>> [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > wind > breaks. So? The point was, you were wrong about the Wright catapult. >>>>> Richard Pearse built an entirely self powered aircraft which successfully >>>>> flew [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Sure, and the facts don't match his letters. LOL - the only 'facts' that contradict his letters are those being reverse engineered by nutcases trying to bash America. There WERE no witnesses to the early flight. > Richard Pearse's last flights were curtailed by bankruptcy and a move of > several [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > is both official and public record. > Richard Pearse was _wrong_ about the timing when he wrote his letters. Yeah. Sure. Whatever desperation helps you put down your betters. >>>>> including figure "8"s >>>> [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > brought > out. And the facts prove you wrong. >>>> Any figure 8s would have came years later -- if they came at all. I see no >>>> evidence he ever made anything but a straight uncontrolled hop; not a true [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] > What proves me to be wrong? How? > Maximum power is _only_ required for takeoff. You're really that stupid aren't you? You're claiming the guy flew for 2 miles on an engine that ran for 45 seconds. Nobody said anything about take off or power. I realize even basic math is beyond you, but come on. You really think this guy was maintaining an average speed of 2 miles in .75 minutes? >>>>> Regards, >>>>> Greg.P. [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > to his land and aircraft. > He was wrong! The only one there was wrong, based entirely on your being jealous of America. You are one sad, sad person. And as an American, I see no reason to condescend to bother with you any more. Plonk. > >>>>>> On 6/28/05 7:18 PM, in article 42C1E8CC.3000908@optusnet.com.au, > >>>>>> [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] > > So? The point was, you were wrong about the Wright catapult. OK, I saw photos in a book purporting to be the first flight and the catapult was there _behind_ the Wright plane. It wasn't in the photo taken from an angle behind the plane, but that's hardly surprising. > >>>>> Richard Pearse built an entirely self powered aircraft which successfully > >>>>> flew [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > LOL - the only 'facts' that contradict his letters are those being reverse > engineered by nutcases trying to bash America. Pearce was forced to leave his farm at the end of 1903 - that's FACT. He can't have built or flown his plane after 1903 because he was no longer in the district and the plane ended up in the local dump where parts were dug up from decades later. > There WERE no witnesses to the early flight. There were a number of flights and there were witnesses to some of them. There were no accredited witnesses nor reporters but there were people who saw hops and flights. > > Richard Pearse's last flights were curtailed by bankruptcy and a move of > > several [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Yeah. Sure. Whatever desperation helps you put down your betters. Richard Pearse did not live in the region after 1903/4 so he could not have been making flights there after that date. > >>>>> including figure "8"s > >>>> [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > > And the facts prove you wrong. You've read a book which eliminates all Pearses flights??? > >>>> Any figure 8s would have came years later -- if they came at all. I see no > >>>> evidence he ever made anything but a straight uncontrolled hop; not a true [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > You're really that stupid aren't you? You're claiming the guy flew for 2 > miles on an engine that ran for 45 seconds. No I am not - the motor would run at maximum output for 45 seconds due to the absence of any proper cooling arrangements. OBVIOUSLY it would run longer if it was not run at full power. Full power was only required for initial takeoff. > Nobody said anything about take > off or power. _I_ said something about takeoff or power! > I realize even basic math is beyond you, but come on. You > really think this guy was maintaining an average speed of 2 miles in .75 > minutes? I'm actually quite good at maths. If you halve the power output you quarter the excess heat generated. The motor was a double acting horozontally opposed twin, mounted at the front of the aircraft in the full slipstream directly driving a propeller mounted on the front of the crankshaft. > >>>>> Regards, > >>>>> Greg.P. [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > The only one there was wrong, based entirely on your being jealous of > America. Why would you be so stupid as to accuse me of being jealous of the US? > You are one sad, sad person. So how many sad, sad people are you? I'm actually quite cheerful as I've just repainted and weathered two LGB wagons and the result is better than I expected. (ref rec.models.railroad) > And as an American, I see no reason to condescend to bother with you any > more. Great! > Plonk. >> On 6/28/05 7:18 PM, in article 42C1E8CC.3000908@optusnet.com.au, >> [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > Regards, > Greg.P. What about Lawrence Hargrave( an Australian ) of which most of the Wright brothers work was based upon his research which was undertaken in the 1890's. SignatureSpam Bait john.howard@aph.gov.au minister@transport.nsw.gov.au alanjones@2gb.com >There were at least 6 individals working separately to build practical aircraft >around 1900-1905. No argument. But the Wrights got there first in 1903. Would someone else have achieved powered flight before, say, the end of 1904? Probably. Does that change anything? Not a bit. >The Wrights built a powered glider which required a catapult to launch. No, it didn't. The Flyer rode along a track to keep it out of the loose beach sand. The track was not a catapult. >Richard Pearse built an entirely self powered aircraft which successfully flew >numerous times from March 1903, including figure "8"s but he did not consider >that he had built a practical flying machine because it would not continue >flying for more than a couple of miles. This is contradicted by Pearse's own recollections. Brian > >There were at least 6 individals working separately to build practical aircraft > >around 1900-1905. [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > This is contradicted by Pearse's own recollections. Richard Pearce was interviewed in the early 1960s. At that time he had just built a helicopter in his suburban back yard, which rather upset his neighbours, and was in a mental hospital where he ended his days. He wasn't exactly a reliable witness of his own past actions. > Brian >>> There were at least 6 individals working separately to build practical >>> aircraft [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > witness of > his own past actions. But he wrote letters in, IIRC, 1911 and 1915 or thereabouts that said he didn't start working on powered flight until 1904. That's not that long after the fact. >> Brian > >>> There were at least 6 individals working separately to build practical > >>> aircraft [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > didn't start working on powered flight until 1904. That's not that long > after the fact. He was bankrupt in 1904 and had lost his farm and aircraft - he was then living hundreds of miles further south without access to his engineering equipment. He was mistaken in regard to the dates. > >> Brian On 6/29/05 3:35 PM, in article 42C305FD.C39864FF@ihug.co.nz, "Greg Procter" <Procter@ihug.co.nz> wrote: >>> There were at least 6 individals working separately to build practical >>> aircraft [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > >> Brian Absolute hogwash! Do try to read up on the subject you claim to know so much about! To quote this site (http://www.nzedge.com/heroes/pearse.html): "Pearse became increasingly paranoid and in June 1951 was admitted to Sunnyside Mental Hospital. There he died, in July 1953 aged 75, of a heart attack." SignatureBrian Ehni > On 6/29/05 3:35 PM, in article 42C305FD.C39864FF@ihug.co.nz, "Greg Procter" > <Procter@ihug.co.nz> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > Sunnyside Mental Hospital. There he died, in July 1953 aged 75, of a heart > attack." OK, so I was a decade out on the end of his life - we were discussing the earlier bits. > "Pearse became increasingly paranoid and in June 1951 was admitted to > Sunnyside Mental Hospital. There he died, in July 1953 aged 75, of a heart > attack." The same place Buffy Summers ended her years, still thinking she was a vampire slayer. On 6/28/05 9:43 PM, in article 42C20ADD.D162CD69@ihug.co.nz, "Greg Procter" <Procter@ihug.co.nz> wrote: >> On 6/28/05 7:18 PM, in article 42C1E8CC.3000908@optusnet.com.au, >> [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > Regards, > Greg.P. I was waiting for this.... Just a couple of quotes from websites: ³Pearse himself, in two letters, the first to Dunedin¹s Evening Star, published on May 10th 1915, the second published in the Christchurch Star on September 15th 1928, didn¹t believe, by his own rigorous standards, that he had achieved proper¹ flight, which for him meant a powered take-off followed by "sustained and controlled flight" http://www.nzedge.com/heroes/pearse.html Then there¹s this: Some early claims to the invention of the airplane: In the Texas hill country, one Jacob Brodbeck experimented with models, and, in 1865, he actually flew an airplane. The flight ended when he crashed into a chicken coop. John Montgomery built gliders in southern California between 1883 and 1911. A great deal of legend surrounds his work and even credits him with powered flight. Glen Ford portrayed Montgomery as the inventor of the airplane in the 1946 movie Gallant Journey. There's good evidence that Gustave Whitehead of Bridgeport, Connecticut, flew his Number 21 airplane over a mile in 1901. We also have photos of several Whitehead flying machines -- all on the ground. There's a lot more: Maxim flew, and Ader flew. Santos Dumont flew after the Wrights, but his flight attracted a great deal of early attention in Europe. http://www.uh.edu/engines/epi1680.htm SignatureBrian Ehni > On 6/28/05 9:43 PM, in article 42C20ADD.D162CD69@ihug.co.nz, "Greg Procter" > <Procter@ihug.co.nz> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] > had achieved proper¹ flight, which for him meant a powered take-off > followed by "sustained and controlled flight" The Wrights also didn't achieve that in 1903 by Pearse's rigorous standards. > http://www.nzedge.com/heroes/pearse.html > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > actually flew an airplane. The flight ended when he crashed into a chicken > coop. Sure, as I've said elsewhere, I'm only claiming Pearse was ahead of the Wright brothers. > John Montgomery built gliders in southern California between 1883 and 1911. > A great deal of legend surrounds his work and even credits him with powered [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > -- > Brian Ehni > On 6/28/05 9:43 PM, in article 42C20ADD.D162CD69@ihug.co.nz, "Greg Procter" > <Procter@ihug.co.nz> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > > http://www.nzedge.com/heroes/pearse.html And you'll note that information of that nature comes from multiple New Zealand websites. It's not like they teach a different version of history down there; it's jut that Greg Proctor is a nutcase. > Then there¹s this: > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > Maxim flew, and Ader flew. Santos Dumont flew after the Wrights, but his > flight attracted a great deal of early attention in Europe. The Santos-Dumont supporters claims to him being first seem to be based solely on a conspiracy theory claiming the Wrights didn't fly for years after 1903 and all the eyewitnesses were in on it and how come there's only one obviously faked photo yadda yadda yadda. > http://www.uh.edu/engines/epi1680.htm On 6/29/05 8:08 PM, in article BEE89438.3A755%ANIM8Rfsk@cox.net, "ANIM8Rfsk" >> I was waiting for this.... >> [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > Zealand websites. It's not like they teach a different version of history > down there; it's jut that Greg Proctor is a nutcase. Not a nutcase, just confused about this. >> Then there¹s this: >> [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > after 1903 and all the eyewitnesses were in on it and how come there's only > one obviously faked photo yadda yadda yadda. Part of that is the Wright's own secretiveness. >> http://www.uh.edu/engines/epi1680.htm SignatureBrian Ehni >>> and a Middle Easterner didn't get to invent the airplane, >> >> Neither did an American. > > Here we go again. Who is it this time? Alberto Santos-Dumont or the > Richard Pearse guy you trundle out every now and then. Brian, I'm not making claims for either individual. And *I've* certainly never "trundled out" Richard Pearse - rooting for the Kiwis is not my forte! :-) My point was that the Wright's did not "invent" the aeroplane, any more than Henry Ford "invented" the motor car, as claimed by the poster I was responding to. >A major reason that "a lot of people around the world have hated the US >for decades", as you put it, is the arrogance and ignorance displayed by >many US citizens. America's contribution to the world generally is not that we invented a great many things the world now takes for granted but that Americans took a great many inventions (some from Americans some not) and combined them in ways no one ever had before. A great many of these did in fact change the world. The automobile, for example went from a curious toy for the rich to an essential means of transportation around the world thanks to Henry Ford's efforts to mass produce it, something no one else had been visionary enough or talented enough to achieve. The electric light, telephone, television and computer are similar accomplishments. Brian I'm sorry, silly me......I thought this was a MODEL RAILROAD newsgroup. ENOUGH ALREADY with the political CRAP!!!!!!!!! BOOOOOOOOOORING!!!! >>A major reason that "a lot of people around the world have hated the US >>for decades", as you put it, is the arrogance and ignorance displayed by [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > Brian > >A major reason that "a lot of people around the world have hated the US > >for decades", as you put it, is the arrogance and ignorance displayed by [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > something no one else had been visionary enough or talented enough to > achieve. The electric light, Like the aeroplane, numerous people were working on the electric light and there are numerous starting points from those experiments. > telephone, television Britain was ahead of the US. > and computer are > similar accomplishments. Britain again. > Brian >Like the aeroplane, numerous people were working on the electric light and >there are numerous starting points from those experiments. Yet Thomas Edison and the Wright Brothers became world famous. >> telephone, television > >Britain was ahead of the US. So was Germany. I did not say the US invented television. I said the US brought television to the masses where the British and Germans did not. >> and computer are similar accomplishments. >Britain again. But the Apple changed the world. Brian > >Like the aeroplane, numerous people were working on the electric light and > >there are numerous starting points from those experiments. > > Yet Thomas Edison and the Wright Brothers became world famous. Of course, they lived in a nation with huge resources. - exactly who ever put carbon fiber filament light bulbs into mass production? Richard Pearce lived in a remote farming community where even his home made motorcycle was seen as a sign of insanity. Under those conditions you don't go claiming you built a machine capable of landing on top of hedges! > >> telephone, television > > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > US brought television to the masses where the British and Germans did > not. I think you should check out your facts - Britain had public broadcast before the US did - the US was more interested in profiting from war than in defending freedoms and democracies so had more time to establish TV broadcasting 1939-41. > >> and computer are similar accomplishments. > > >Britain again. > > But the Apple changed the world. The Sinclair ZX80/81 softened me and about another million people to computers. > Brian >> I think one major reason a lot of people around the world have hated >> the US for decades is simple jealousy, that it was primarily white [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] > You have a strange idea of what's fair, if you regard the "invention" of > Windows as a good thing... Hey it's what most people use baby cakes deal with it. > deal with it Oh, we do; we disable large parts of it, like Outhouse Excess or Internet Exploder, and find third party software not so prone to silly bugger security holes. If it makes you feel good to make a virtue of often needing to use something that sucks in so many ways, that says a lot for Gee Billy's products. SignatureSteve > Hey it's what most people use baby cakes deal with it. Popular doesn't mean good, "Baby Cakes". I deal with it by using other OS's, and I get by just fine, thanks. Doug >>> and it somehow isn't fair that Bill Gates got to create Windows >>> instead of somebody from the third world. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >> > Hey it's what most people use baby cakes deal with it. I do, merchant banker, I use a Mac. > > > Mexican fans took up the chant "Osama! Osama!" during a recent > > > US-Canada Olympic soccer game held south of our border. Last month, [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > I think one major reason a lot of people around the world have hated > the US for decades is simple jealousy, Nobody, other than those invaded by or who have a government forced on them by the US, hate the US - do try to get in touch with reality! > that it was primarily white > Americans of Western European descent who invented most of the > technology That's certainly not true - about 75% of modern technology is British, 20% German. Patents are of course a different story. > and advances the world freely uses and it makes much of the > rest of the world look stupid as they've been around a lot longer than [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > world. They're upset that an African didn't get to invent the > automobile, German. > and a Middle Easterner didn't get to invent the airplane, New Zealand. AEROPLANE, btw. Try to avoid baby-talk. > and a Filipino didn't create the Polio Vaccine, and a Greek didn't get > to invent the telephone, and it somehow isn't fair that Bill Gates got > to create Windows instead of somebody from the third world. Bill Gates and Windows succeeded against other competitors due to the size of the US market, not because of any superiority of the product. So long as you go on deluding yourselves that "jealousy" is the reason you're generally disliked then you're never going to understand reality. Regards, Greg.P. > > > > Mexican fans took up the chant "Osama! Osama!" during a recent > > > > US-Canada Olympic soccer game held south of our border. Last month, [quoted text clipped - 43 lines] > So long as you go on deluding yourselves that "jealousy" is the reason > you're generally disliked then you're never going to understand reality. Of course it's jealousy but try not to let that destroy you. > Regards, > Greg.P. > > > > > Mexican fans took up the chant "Osama! Osama!" during a recent > > > > > US-Canada Olympic soccer game held south of our border. Last month, [quoted text clipped - 45 lines] > > Of course it's jealousy but try not to let that destroy you. What on earth do you think you might have that would make me jealous of you? > > Regards, > > Greg.P. First trains (england & germany) http://inventors.about.com/library/inventors/blrailroad.htm Fisrt airplane (usa) http://www.uh.edu/engines/epi1675.htm louis pasteur and vaccination (french) http://www.zephyrus.co.uk/louispasteur.html Theory of relativity (german) http://www.albert-einstein.org/.index2.html Diesel engine (german) http://inventors.about.com/library/inventors/bldiesel.htm first sattelite in space (russia) http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/pao/History/sputnik/ First Man in space (russia) http://starchild.gsfc.nasa.gov/docs/StarChild/space_level2/gagarin.html First man on moon (usa) http://www.nasa.gov/audience/forkids/home/F_First_Person_on_Moon.html invented fireworks and paper... (china) http://www.crystalinks.com/chinainventions.html invented the interned (Al Gore , usa) http://www.sethf.com/gore/ Jb >> > Mexican fans took up the chant "Osama! Osama!" during a recent >> > US-Canada Olympic soccer game held south of our border. Last month, [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > to invent the telephone, and it somehow isn't fair that Bill Gates got > to create Windows instead of somebody from the third world. On 6/28/05 11:19 PM, in article Djpwe.1823059$6l.438956@pd7tw2no, "J Barnstorf" <j.barnstorf@shaw.ca> wrote: > louis pasteur and vaccination (french) > http://www.zephyrus.co.uk/louispasteur.html Once, while stationed in Germany, I had occasion to visit my parents who were win Paris for a neurosurgical meeting. Traveling by train from Germany to Paris, I was struck by the HUGE difference in the two countries. On the German side of the border, hausfraus were sweeping the sidewalks and streets; on the French, there was trash blowing around, weeds, etc. I asked my dad, "How could a country as filthy as France have given birth to someone like Louis Pasteur?" Without a moment's hesitation, he replied: "Because France needed him!" SignatureBrian Ehni forgot an important one... democracy (Greece) http://ancienthistory.about.com/od/democracy/ http://www.commondreams.org/views02/1106-07.htm > First trains (england & germany) > http://inventors.about.com/library/inventors/blrailroad.htm [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] >> to invent the telephone, and it somehow isn't fair that Bill Gates got >> to create Windows instead of somebody from the third world. > I think one major reason a lot of people around the world have hated > the US for decades is simple jealousy What a f--king dork! Ignorant sluts like you make me ashamed when you claim to be an American like me. SignatureSteve On 6/29/05 11:09 AM, in article 1qasoywozj6o8.13v6cfpp1tv2q$.dlg@40tude.net, >> I think one major reason a lot of people around the world have hated >> the US for decades is simple jealousy > > What a f--king dork! Ignorant sluts like you make me ashamed when you > claim to be an American like me. Not all of us want to be Americans like you.. 8^) But I agree with your assessment! SignatureBrian Ehni >> > Mexican fans took up the chant "Osama! Osama!" during a recent >> > US-Canada Olympic soccer game held south of our border. Last month, [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] >and a Filipino didn't create the Polio Vaccine, and a Greek didn't get >to invent the telephone, No that was a Scot who lived briefly in the US. The world's first long distance telephone call (one-way) was received at Paris, Ontario by Bell from his father and uncle at Brantford, Ontario over "borrowed" telegraph lines. He later moved to Canada. >and it somehow isn't fair that Bill Gates got >to create Windows instead of somebody from the third world. "What is freedom of expression? Without the freedom to offend, it ceases to exist " -Salman Rushdie "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." -Martin Luther King "A gentleman is a man who can disagree without being disagreeable." Anon "Revolution in Politics is an abrupt change in the form of misgovernment." Ambrose Bierce "I don't make jokes. I just watch the government and report the facts" - Mark Twain > Philadelphia transplant Susan Steele, head of Forum management company > in London, has noticed that many Europeans have started using the > phrase "that's American," which is shorthand, Steele says, for "not > taking anyone else into consideration." Bingo. A gold Medal to Susan Steele. She has the US Political Attitude bang on! Note I Said POLITICAL Attitude, i.e. the attitude of the current political administration, the attitude of BIG Business, not the attitude of the people. The people of the US are some of the finest people in the world! I have the pleasure of knowing many of them. But the politicians you elect. Where do you find them. Do you go out of the way to find the worst possible people to govern you? God help us all if you don't elect some good people soon. You're on that slippery slope to third world status that you and the world will not soon recover from. Bill Dixon >> Philadelphia transplant Susan Steele, head of Forum management company >> in London, has noticed that many Europeans have started using the [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Bill Dixon Just ones that have our interests at heart thank god. > Mexican fans took up the chant "Osama! Osama!" during a recent > US-Canada Olympic soccer game held south of our border. Last > month, protesters in Athens chanted "Sept. 11 every day!" during > an anti-American rally. And just now, hordes of rec.arts.tv citizens are chanting "Death to Off-Topic Spam!" SignatureWilliam December Starr <wdstarr@panix.com> Got spit on in Spain? Thank a Republican. On 7/1/05 9:49 AM, in article 1120229370.538145.207600@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com, "rst" <senninha@ziplip.com> wrote: > Got spit on in Spain? Thank a Republican. A Republican went to Spain to spit on someone? What a waste of time! There's plenty of people worth spitting on right here! SignatureBrian Ehni A few years ago I was in Malaysia when an anti-American protest took place. When I watched CNN it looked as if the whole country was rioting but if the cameras had pulled back then they would have seem that the protesters were in the minority. The news media manage what you see. Then you got idiots who 'quote' that the majority of people wish Americans dead etc etc etc. The reality is that yes we Brits consider Americans to be too loud and too insular. But then, we consider the Germans to be rather cold and aloof people. And don't get me started on the French :-) God save from idiots who 'summarise' the views of the world to suit their purposes. Few 'normal' people would want to wish death and destruction on others no matter what their politics. |
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