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Model Forum / General / Railroads / August 2006Walmart - Diecast Rolling Stock - WITH GRAFFITI
http://www.wheelswings-things.com/index.php?item=396&ret=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wheels wings-things.com%2Findex.php%3Fpage%3D1%26category%3D24 Saw these at Walmart, didn't know whether to laugh, cry, or both. Watch the line wrap. If you can't get it to work, Google on Maisto Enamelized Graffiti. Apparently, this is one way to get kids interested in model trains - by covering them with graffiti, and making that the SELLING POINT. Apparently, looking at the package, each highlights a different "artist". I know, I know, I don't "get it", too old, etc. All of us in this hobby are artists to some degree, and I can appreciate the talents involved, but to me, it begs the question of why not put it on canvas instead of other people's property. And yes, I've heard the story about how putting it out on public display is integral to the art, a commentary on the dark side of urban life for youth, yadda, yadda, yadda. And, I can even understand why some modelers put it on their rolling stock - hell, nine out of ten cars on the mixed freights around here are covered in it the stuff. Unit trains seem less likely to suffer from it, I'm guessing because they tend to keep moving. I don't subscribe to the "hobby is dying" philosophy - I think it's changing, as all things do, over time. But somehow, this seems sad to me, that kids find the graffiti more appealing than the cars. Chris Kansas City Not only that, but they are 1:131 scale!  SignatureFrank Rosenbaum Please support the following train meets if you can Gratiot Valley ( www.gvrr.org ) in Macomb Michigan in March and November and the Kalamazoo Model Railroad Historical Society ( www.kmrhs.org ) at the Kalamazoo Fairgrounds in Kalamazoo MI in October. Also check out the Westchester Model Railroad Club's train meet in Greenwich CT in November and March. Visit this web site to see my bridge and the KMRHS http://tinyurl.com/7uqdr Frank Rosenbaum > http://www.wheelswings-things.com/index.php?item=396&ret=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wheels wings-things.com%2Findex.php%3Fpage%3D1%26category%3D24 > [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > Chris > Kansas City I could live with them selling the graffiti cars - I'd buy a few... and repaint them... and use them! But PLEASE... "approximately 1:131"?!?!? What kind of a screwed up proportion is THAT? Why didn't they use an EXISTING scale, instead of pulling some wacky one out of left field? Even 1:100, 1:120, 1:144, 1:160 (hint hint hint...) 1:131?!?! What were they thinking? SignatureEvaluating all GUIs by the example of Windows is like evaluating all cars by the example of Yugos. > 1:131?!?! What were they thinking? They were thinking? Really? SignatureTh lotto must be rigged, I should have won by now. Modular furniture is cruel and unusual. > http://www.wheelswings-things.com/index.php?item=396&ret=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wheels wings-things.com%2Findex.php%3Fpage%3D1%26category%3D24 > > Saw these at Walmart, didn't know whether to laugh, cry, or both. [...] What makes me laugh is the use of "who's" for "whose." >> http://www.wheelswings-things.com/index.php?item=396&ret=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wheels wings-things.com%2Findex.php%3Fpage%3D1%26category%3D24 >> >> Saw these at Walmart, didn't know whether to laugh, cry, or both. > [...] > > What makes me laugh is the use of "who's" for "whose." Yea, their a bunch of loosers! <tpfic> SignatureSteve >>> http://www.wheelswings-things.com/index.php?item=396&ret=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wheels wings-things.com%2Findex.php%3Fpage%3D1%26category%3D24 >>> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > >Yea, their a bunch of loosers! <tpfic> Ouch. That was so painful to read that my brain hurts. -- Ray >>>> http://www.wheelswings-things.com/index.php?item=396&ret=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wheels wings-things.com%2Findex.php%3Fpage%3D1%26category%3D24 >>>> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Ouch. That was so painful to read that my brain hurts. Some years ago, on the BORDB CompuServe forum, some user was flaming a Borland TechSupport guy, and a number of TeamBorland volunteers (like me) and also some public members who were trying to help him get some basic relational database design stuff and Paradox programming approaches through his thick skull despite stubborn resistance. He overtemped and flamed out screaming "You're a looser! You loose!!" (but in ALL CAPS, natch). I wondered if it were true, and in any case how did El Flameo come to be so intimately acquainted with the state of his erstwhile helper's bowels. SInce then such illiteracy has only increased. SignatureSteve * Spelling Counts * "each train will come with a card with info of the artist" How the heck did he track down the so called artist? (he should teach the police that trick) And just what kind of info will be on those cards? Their prison record? What kind of drugs they take daily? The names of BOTH parents, if KNOWN? Wonder if each artist receives royalties of each one sold? Maybe they got a lump sum at the outset and it was already spent on more paint and drugs and guns.............GM > "each train will come with a card with info of the artist" > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > royalties of each one sold? Maybe they got a lump sum at the outset and > it was already spent on more paint and drugs and guns.............GM Are you being serious or sarcastic? Sour-castic > Are you being serious or sarcastic? Are you seriously asking that question? Who could be serious about that schlock? Well, maybe somebody with a collection of personally signed and "highlighted" Thomas Kincaid sofa "art" . . . SignatureSteve > > Are you being serious or sarcastic? > > Are you seriously asking that question? Who could be serious about that > schlock? Well, maybe somebody with a collection of personally signed and > "highlighted" Thomas Kincaid sofa "art" . . . As you've pointed out, art appreciation is a very subjective thing. I've always been fascinated by modern graffiti, from the bizarre scribblings of a gangbanger's tag on a bridge or car, to some of the amazing murals I've seen on railcars. The other day, I saw the entire side of an 89' auto carrier covered; it was incredible. How someone pulled this off without scaffolding is beyond me. Interestingly, only the road name and number were left uncovered. As far as the die-cast graffiti cars go, they are crappy products (wheels with flanges a mile high and couplers that look like they were designed by a blind man after having a X2F described to him) that are merely pandering to the urban street cred ethic so prevalent in American youth culture these days. I can only hope that some of the kids buying this crap will further investigate about trains, model or prototype. and lol, I think Kincaid is crap, too. It's art, but not my kind. > It's art . . . like the National Enquirer is literature. SignatureSteve Steve Caple spake thus: >>It's art > > . . . like the National Enquirer is literature. Apples and oranges; the Enquirer is journalism, not literature. SignatureIn order to embark on a new course, the only one that will solve the problem: negotiations and peace with the Palestinians, the Lebanese, the Syrians. And: with Hamas and Hizbullah. Because it's only with enemies that one makes peace. - Uri Avnery, Israeli writer and peace activist with Gush Shalom. (http://counterpunch.org/avnery08032006.html) > the Enquirer is journalism That's generous! Nat'l Enquirer is to journalism as Kincaid's smarmy mass produced schlock is to art. With the same flavor of exploitation. SignatureSteve Steve Caple spake thus: >>the Enquirer is journalism > > That's generous! Nat'l Enquirer is to journalism as Kincaid's smarmy mass > produced schlock is to art. With the same flavor of exploitation. How can you say those terrible negative things about Thomas Kinkade? The "Painter of Light"? I started loving his work just after my frontal lobotomy; I'm even thinking about buying into his new community, "The Gates at Old Hawthorne" in Columbia, MO: http://www.thomaskinkadecompany.com/general_pages.asp?id=30001&NewsId=197&hideC=yes SignatureIn order to embark on a new course, the only one that will solve the problem: negotiations and peace with the Palestinians, the Lebanese, the Syrians. And: with Hamas and Hizbullah. Because it's only with enemies that one makes peace. - Uri Avnery, Israeli writer and peace activist with Gush Shalom. (http://counterpunch.org/avnery08032006.html) On Thu, 17 Aug 2006 11:05:24 -0700, David Nebenzahl posted in article <44e4af0c$0$25422$822641b3@news.adtechcomputers.com> ... > Steve Caple spake thus: > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > Gates at Old Hawthorne" in Columbia, MO: > http://www.thomaskinkadecompany.com/general_pages.asp?id=30001&NewsId=197&hideC=yes Jos Sances offers Kinkade in a new light (look closely): <http://www.josart.net/kin-.html> My favorite is the warplanes (F-14s?) attacking the lighthouse. SignatureOvC > I've always been fascinated by modern graffiti, from the bizarre > scribblings of a gangbanger's tag on a bridge or car, to some of the > amazing murals I've seen on railcars. The other day, I saw the entire > side of an 89' auto carrier covered; it was incredible. How someone > pulled this off without scaffolding is beyond me. Interestingly, only > the road name and number were left uncovered. We've had some problems in the area with "tagging." I doubt if any of the people who have had their homes, garages or cars so marked would see anything incredible about it. I don't suppose that their insurance companies liked it either. dlm > We've had some problems in the area with "tagging." I doubt if any of the > people who have had their homes, garages or cars so marked would see > anything incredible about it. I don't suppose that their insurance > companies liked it either. > > dlm Quite true. Although I am fascinated by graffiti, I would still use the RR emergency numbers in my cell phone to report someone spraying a car. Regardless of my feelings, it is still vandalism, and illegal. Drew posted in part: >As far as the die-cast graffiti cars go, they >are crappy products (wheels with flanges [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >further investigate about trains, model or >prototype. >and lol, I think Kincaid is crap, too. It's art, >but not my kind. I agree on a couple points. This type of product is aimed at a trashy, criminal element of our culture which unfortunately has managed to glorify itself in such a way as to attract children into thinking it's "cool". This the result of law makers failing to take the problems seriously. It's before my time but I'm thinking back in the early depression gangster era, that gangs had a "cool" air about them too, that is until the government got serious and created "G-Men" to hunt them down and take them dead or alive. Then G-Men became the cool ones. As mentioned in another post, it's incredible that a known criminal can have his crimes duplicated on "collectibles" and yet the person is still apparently running free and continuing his tagging spree. It'd be nice to see some survalience set up and catch the guy in the act, then give him a year in prison for every boxcar that could be found with the same tag on it. Daily prison work would be scrubbing grafitti off boxcars at the local train yard. Then everybody wins. Personally if I were doing modern layouts, I'd leave the grafitti off the cars. If realisim is so important, why not go through the whole layout and tag all the buildings, fences and billboards as well? Put in some figures selling crack in a alley. Play some hip hop music while you run your trains? Sorry if I'm getting carried away but I see this crap all over my town, not just on trains. These jerks can do hundreds of dollars of property damage every night with their "art" and I find nothing valuable about their message. Then there is Kincaid. His early stuff was O.K. even though it all looks the same after awhile, and as a bit of an artist myself I don't feel out of place saying I've noted some proportion and balance issues on a few of his works. Main problem in my opinion is over commercialization of his art. I mean, enough already. What's it going to show up on next; toilet paper? (and don't you know he'd do it if the idea crossed his desk?) :) On the other hand, he's probably richer than everyone in this group combined so he deserves credit for knowing how to milk art. $29.49 for a grafitti covered miniature boxcar? Must be DCC. ~fd64 > This type of product is aimed at a trashy, > criminal element of our culture E-Bay collectors, the scourge of our time! Although, I'd use the word "society", rather than "culture", to diminish the oxymoronic overtones. Kincaid is to art as Jerry Falwell (or better yet, Billy James Hargis, noted bisexual bible college president and predator) is to spirituality. SignatureSteve Steve Caple spake thus: >>This type of product is aimed at a trashy, >>criminal element of our culture [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Kincaid is to art as Jerry Falwell (or better yet, Billy James Hargis, > noted bisexual bible college president and predator) is to spirituality. Who was it who did the character "Billy Sol Hargis"? Remember that? SignatureIn order to embark on a new course, the only one that will solve the problem: negotiations and peace with the Palestinians, the Lebanese, the Syrians. And: with Hamas and Hizbullah. Because it's only with enemies that one makes peace. - Uri Avnery, Israeli writer and peace activist with Gush Shalom. (http://counterpunch.org/avnery08032006.html) >> Kincaid is to art as Jerry Falwell (or better yet, Billy James Hargis, >> noted bisexual bible college president and predator) is to spirituality. > > Who was it who did the character "Billy Sol Hargis"? Remember that? Yeah, but no - I remember the bit, but not who did it. Billy Sol Estes must have been the milkman in the neighborhood where Tom DeLay was bon. The very Rev. Hargis boffing students of both sexes was a great match up for Billy Sol Estes. SignatureSteve >>> Kincaid is to art as Jerry Falwell (or better yet, Billy James Hargis, >>> noted bisexual bible college president and predator) is to spirituality. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >The very Rev. Hargis boffing students of both sexes was a great match up >for Billy Sol Estes. That would have ben Don Imus. ( a former RR brakeman, IIRC) Steve Caple posted: >E-Bay collectors, the scourge of our time! And God, I know I'm one. Sort of anyway. I just sold off my old Star Wars action figures. The only thing I really collect now are constructable sailing ships from a Pirate themed card game that's been on the market a couple years now. Unfortunately E-Bay is about the only way to complete a series. >Although, I'd use the word "society", >rather than "culture", to diminish the >oxymoronic overtones. I try to use appropriate words in rantings but since my average was a C+ in English classes in school, I do often misuse a word. I'll agree with your correction. :) I also forgot to use my spellcheck on the first post. Forgot. On another post, Drew wrote: >lol, I've seen hobos and "Kilroy was here" >on quite a few layouts :) Good point. In fact, now I must defend my view because I don't mind those type of inclusions. I guess it has to do with the era. Hobos to my knowledge had a moral structure to a degree in their societies. I'm barely old enough to remember seeing a hobo pass by once in awhile sitting in an open boxcar while we waited for a train to go by at a crossing. My parents however have told me stories about when they lived near a railroad yard and often a hobo, hat in hand, would knock on their door to ask if he could do any chores around the yard in exchange for some food. Other memories were things like Red Skelton's character of hobo, a kid's show broadcast from L.A. called and hosted by "Hobo Kelly", a few other TV shows and movies ("Emperor of the North" of course), and especially on Halloween: of the home made costumes, hobos always seemed to be the most popular, knapsack on a stick and all. I guess they were a nuisance in many ways but not seen in the same bad light as todays taggers who seem to be marking up things just to be marking up things. Hobos didn't appear to seek to vandalize property. Their markings on trains from what I could tell were mostly to pass messages along to other hobos or let others know they were in the area or had passed through. I never saw anything permanent like paint used but rather chalk, and most names or messages were small in size. There's probably a website or book out there that covers their history and ways. Anybody have any hobo stories? Are my memories about how it was everywhere or was there a darker side? >I suppose my view of graffiti is somewhat >skewed. A friend of mine used to spray [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >he's never touched a gun or illicit drug in >his life. Good to hear. I guess not 100% of them are bad at heart. :) ~fd64 >clip >Then there is Kincaid. His early stuff was O.K. even though it all looks >the same after awhile, and as a bit of an artist myself I don't feel out [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >toilet paper? (and don't you know he'd do it if the idea crossed his >desk?) :) >On the other hand, he's probably richer than everyone in this group >combined so he deserves credit for knowing how to milk art. At least no one has mentioned the Kincaid decorated trains that are available by subscription...ooops! http://ak.collectiblestoday.com/images/pdtl-49039.jpg How long before someones posts a question about how much this is worth? SignatureKen Rice -=:=- kennrice (AT) erols (DOT) com http://users.erols.com/kennrice - Lego Compatible Flex Track, Civil War Round Table of DC & Concentration Camp made of Lego bricks http://members.tripod.com/~kennrice Maps of Ultima 7 Parts 1 & 2, Prophecy of the Shadow, Savage Empire, Crusaders of Dark Savant & Others. > Personally if I were doing modern layouts, I'd leave the grafitti off > the cars. If realisim is so important, why not go through the whole [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > dollars of property damage every night with their "art" and I find > nothing valuable about their message. lol, I've seen hobos and "Kilroy was here" on quite a few layouts :) I suppose my view of graffiti is somewhat skewed. A friend of mine used to spray paint everything when we were kids. He has since gone legit, and turned his artistic expressions into a successful advertising business, painting murals for local companies, among other things. And he's never touched a gun or illicit drug in his life. > A friend of mine used to spray paint everything when we were kids. He has > since gone > legit, and turned his artistic expressions into a successful advertising > business, painting > murals for local companies, among other things. But therein lies the main difference... the people paying him "want" him to paint the things. I don't think railroads, municipalities or private homeowners want their personal property spraypainted, no matter how it looks. dlm > But therein lies the main difference... the people paying him "want" him to > paint the things. I don't think railroads, municipalities or private > homeowners want their personal property spraypainted, no matter how it > looks. I agree. Regardless of my interest, most graffiti is vandalism, and illegal. >> But therein lies the main difference... the people paying him "want" him to >> paint the things. I don't think railroads, municipalities or private [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > I agree. Regardless of my interest, most graffiti is vandalism, and > illegal. And most of it is actively ugly. But then that Kincaid graffiti'd train set is actively stupid. SignatureSteve "Daily prison work would be scrubbing grafitti off boxcars at the local train yard. Then everybody wins." I'm not sure if I ran a railroad I'd want these people on my property in a position where they can learn firsthand how things operated securitywise. Sounds like an invitation for trouble down the road. Might not be a 'win' situation for the railroads. Eric >http://www.wheelswings-things.com/index.php?item=396&ret=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wheels wings-things.com%2Findex.php%3Fpage%3D1%26category%3D24 > [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] >Chris >Kansas City If you are modeling present day railroading, you simply must have it. Charles > >http://www.wheelswings-things.com/index.php?item=396&ret=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wheels wings-things.com%2Findex.php%3Fpage%3D1%26category%3D24 > > [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > > Charles I have to agree. For all the articles on weathering, foliage, adding rust to the rails, etc, to say that you won't "deface" (as I have seen it put in other posts) your rolling stock is just plain ignoring reality. Marc. I've puchased a few of the MDC cars they did with graffitti. Heck, I've even got a Microscale graffitti set...works great to hide a bad decal job ;) (I was doing a car that the set only had one of the dimensional data, and I messed up one. So I put graffitti over the location to hide the lack of data :) |
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