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Model Forum / General / Railroads / April 2008



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New England tourist

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Ed Callaghan - 20 Apr 2008 11:10 GMT
I live near Cambridge, England. Flying from London to Boston and
touring New England next month for three weeks. I would like to see
some US model railroad layouts but looking at Model Railroader it
seems you guys don't have exhibitions all over the place as in the UK,
perhaps because your layouts are mostly too large to transport. Are
there perhaps any permanent exhibitions I could visit? Or maybe
preserved railroads which happen to have a model?
Geezer - 20 Apr 2008 15:46 GMT
>I live near Cambridge, England. Flying from London to Boston and
> touring New England next month for three weeks. I would like to see
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> there perhaps any permanent exhibitions I could visit? Or maybe
> preserved railroads which happen to have a model?

The Model Railroader Magazine webpage has a section listing permanent
displays and coming events, which you can search by state.  The listings are
at http://www.trains.com/trc/community/rrattractions/
Perhaps this will help find some displays.

An outstanding layout in New England is the New England, Berkshire & Western
RR of the Rensselaer Model Railroad Society which is a student organization
at Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute in Troy, NY.  It is highly recommended
if you can include it in your trip.  Information is available at their very
complete web site at http://railroad.union.rpi.edu/article.php?article=53 
Please note that you must email them in advance to make a reservation for
the mini-open house they offer before the members only Wednesday operating
sessions.

Have a good visit.   Geezer
Len - 20 Apr 2008 18:15 GMT
> "Ed Callaghan" <callaghan@paston.co.uk> wrote in message

news:18c75d88-4915-4263-8bf6-f10b1a1511aa@p25g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
> >I live near Cambridge, England. Flying from London to Boston and
> > touring New England next month for three weeks. I would like to see
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
>
> Have a good visit.   Geezer

Not a model, but if you should get down to Connecticut you can visit
the Valley Railroad/Essex Steam Train in Essex, CT. You may also want
to check out the Branford Trolley Museum in East Haven, CT (Where
"Big John's" RDC seat memorial plaques are located), and Connecticut
Electric Railway Association Trolley Museum, located in East Windsor,
CT.

They all have web sites with exact location and hours information if
you want to check them out.

Funny how so many of those place names sound like places in England,
isn't it? ;^))

Len
Frank A.  Rosenbaum - 21 Apr 2008 04:20 GMT
>> "Ed Callaghan" <callaghan@paston.co.uk> wrote in message
>>
[quoted text clipped - 41 lines]
> Electric Railway Association Trolley Museum, located in East Windsor,
> CT.

I thought that Big John's RDC was at the Danbury Railway Museum. Did it
move?

Signature

Frank Rosenbaum
Please Support the following train shows:
Trains Trains and More Trains, Puyallup, WA.: www.ttmtshows.com
Kalamazoo Model Railroad Historical Society, MI.: www.kmrhs.org
Gratiot Valley Railroad Club, MI: www.gvrr.org

Len - 21 Apr 2008 06:44 GMT
> >> "Ed Callaghan" <callaghan@paston.co.uk> wrote in message

news:18c75d88-4915-4263-8bf6-f10b1a1511aa@p25g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
> >> >I live near Cambridge, England. Flying from London to Boston and
> >> > touring New England next month for three weeks. I would like to
[quoted text clipped - 41 lines]
> I thought that Big John's RDC was at the Danbury Railway Museum. Did it
> move?

You are correct sir, my bad. I let the grandkids distract me and I
jumped from the middle of one line on the list I made to the middle
of the next. Oops!

Len
Pac Man - 21 Apr 2008 16:19 GMT
> An outstanding layout in New England is the New England, Berkshire &
> Western RR of the Rensselaer Model Railroad Society which is a student
> organization at Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute in Troy, NY.

   New York is in New England???  (I think people in seven states just
threw up)  More like 20-some miles outside of New England.  New England
consists of Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont, Massaschusetts, Connecticut and
Rhode Island, *not* New frickin' York.  ;-)
   On a semi-more serious note here, while the NEB&W is a first rate
layout, their apparent arrogance is also of the highest order.  They are
great modelers...and they know it.

Paul A. Cutler III
*************
Weather Or No Go New Haven
*************
OvC - 21 Apr 2008 17:24 GMT
On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 15:19:51 GMT, Pac Man posted in article
<rg2Pj.1572$Ks1.483@trnddc01> ...

[...]

>     On a semi-more serious note here, while the NEB&W is a first rate
> layout, their apparent arrogance is also of the highest order.  They are
> great modelers...and they know it.

Please expand:  collectively, or individually?

On the Bortle Scale of arrogance, with the Perfect Professor of All
Model Railroad Knowledge scoring a perfect 11, how do they stack up?  
(Yes, since you asked, I *am* watching paint dry...)

When I had access, the pay side of their site ('Just 17 cents a day
for access to our model railroad library!') had some pretty good
freight car info and photos.

Signature

OvC

Pac Man - 21 Apr 2008 17:44 GMT
> Please expand:  collectively, or individually?

   It was from their old website and webmaster when they went to a pay site
and more strict visitation rules for the layout.  He had some things to say
about it that rubbed me the wrong way at the time.  From talking with some
others that have been there, I understood that attitude to be not-uncommon
at RPI's HO layout.  Now, if I'm mistaken, I apologize.  But so far, that's
my reasoning.

> On the Bortle Scale of arrogance, with the Perfect Professor of All
> Model Railroad Knowledge scoring a perfect 11, how do they stack up?
> (Yes, since you asked, I *am* watching paint dry...)

   Oh, christ, nothing's that bad!  lol  BTW, have you been following along
on the latest tripe from Professor Perfect on the MR Forum?  Gee, I sure
couldn't see that coming!  Classic Bortle...  Whatever happened to his
promise that he would never post on the MR Forum ever again because of all
the armchair model railroaders that infest that place that he detests so
much?

> When I had access, the pay side of their site ('Just 17 cents a day
> for access to our model railroad library!') had some pretty good
> freight car info and photos.

   They have great info, no denying it.  However, they didn't appear to be
very gracious about it at the time as I recall.  Maybe time's have changed?

Paul A. Cutler III
*************
Weather Or No Go New Haven
*************
OvC - 21 Apr 2008 19:34 GMT
On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 16:44:08 GMT, Pac Man posted in article
<sv3Pj.1576$Ks1.838@trnddc01> ...

> > Please expand:  collectively, or individually?
>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> at RPI's HO layout.  Now, if I'm mistaken, I apologize.  But so far, that's
> my reasoning.

Ah, thanx.  My only exposure is the website and corresponding with a
few members/ex-members on forums -- haven't noticed arrogance, just
confidence supported by knowledge.  I suppose every club has its
Bortle.

> > On the Bortle Scale of arrogance, with the Perfect Professor of All
> > Model Railroad Knowledge scoring a perfect 11, how do they stack up?
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> on the latest tripe from Professor Perfect on the MR Forum?  Gee, I sure
> couldn't see that coming!  Classic Bortle...

I made some popcorn and poured a Smithwick's when I saw he'd responded
to Zane's post.  LOL'ed at his '100 hobby shops/city' and 'a hobby
shop in every village' comments;  perhaps such existed on planet
Xordax, but sadly, not on Earth.  And now his mantra is that his facts
are self-evident.  Self-awareness is such a terrible thing to lose.

What's a bit disturbing but not unexpected is the number of sycophants
coming out of the benchwork to agree with him, unaware of the flaccid
foundation of his arguments.

> Whatever happened to his
> promise that he would never post on the MR Forum ever again because of all
> the armchair model railroaders that infest that place that he detests so
> much?

His promises, 'facts', and logic are drawn from the same well.

I think MR is the only audience he has left.  If the MR mods had any
balls, he'd be relegated to donning a sandwich board and yammering on
street corners.

Here's a New Haven question:  Would any of New Haven's 1937 AAR
boxcars (10' H, 4/5 IDE) be seen with the script 'NYNH&H' in the late
'50s/ early '60s, or were they all repainted by then?  If so, what's a
reasonably accurate paint or paint mix for the sides?

Signature

OvC

Pac Man - 21 Apr 2008 22:46 GMT
> Ah, thanx.  My only exposure is the website and corresponding with a
> few members/ex-members on forums -- haven't noticed arrogance, just
> confidence supported by knowledge.  I suppose every club has its
> Bortle.

   Lordy, ain't that the truth.  :-D

> I made some popcorn and poured a Smithwick's when I saw he'd responded
> to Zane's post.  LOL'ed at his '100 hobby shops/city' and 'a hobby
> shop in every village' comments;  perhaps such existed on planet
> Xordax, but sadly, not on Earth.  And now his mantra is that his facts
> are self-evident.  Self-awareness is such a terrible thing to lose.

   Heck, I started making a Grey Goose screwdriver as soon as a I saw the
original post from Howard Zane.  Sure enough, within 24 hours, there was a
Bortle appearance (I'm disappointed that it took him so long...he must have
lost his internet connection in that ivory tower of his).  You know how with
some folks you have to draw a pentagram on the floor to summon them?  With
the "Everlasting Know-It-All", all you have to do is put the word "Future"
in a topic header, and he's all over it like a rash.  I have a feeling that
if we started a thread about using Future Floor Wax for sealing models, we'd
have a visitation.

> What's a bit disturbing but not unexpected is the number of sycophants
> coming out of the benchwork to agree with him, unaware of the flaccid
> foundation of his arguments.

   Hey, as far as we know, they could be sock puppets...  What's really
disturbing is that the Grand Nagus of Model Railroading actually belongs to
a club...which means there must be some folks that actually want him around.
<shudder>
   We've had our share of Bortles in our club.  They don't tend to last too
long (thank god).  They currently infest other clubs in the area, for the
most part.  So we don't have to improve our own club to make it look better,
we just spin off our troubles to other clubs so they look worse!  ;-)

> His promises, 'facts', and logic are drawn from the same well.

   That's not a well, that's a septic tank.

> I think MR is the only audience he has left.  If the MR mods had any
> balls, he'd be relegated to donning a sandwich board and yammering on
> street corners.

   Nah, they are too busy trying to get us all to sing "Kum-ba-ya" while
joining hands in a circle.  To be fair, they have been less restrictive than
Atlas has been since the great '04 shut down, but they have a couple member
mods that are trying a little too hard (mods should be seen and not
heard...at least while being a mod).

> Here's a New Haven question:  Would any of New Haven's 1937 AAR
> boxcars (10' H, 4/5 IDE) be seen with the script 'NYNH&H' in the late
> '50s/ early '60s, or were they all repainted by then?  If so, what's a
> reasonably accurate paint or paint mix for the sides?

   Um, sure, ask me the hard ones.  I think there would be some pieces of
rolling stock around with the script logo in the 1950's/1960's as even some
locos (like one FB-2 here, a few RS-3's there, etc.) never got McGinnis
paint.  But it would have looked like crap.
   I just tend to use boxcar red, but if you want the right color for sure,
ask on the NH Forum at www.nhrhta.org.  The guy who writes for the
"Essential Freight Car" series for RMC is a regular there.  His name is Ted
Cullota, who owns Speed Witch Media (http://www.speedwitch.com/).  If he
doesn't know, then probably no one does.  Heck, try sending him an e-mail
directly from his website.

Paul A. Cutler III
*************
Weather Or No Go New Haven
*************
OvC - 22 Apr 2008 00:05 GMT
On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 21:46:35 GMT, Pac Man posted in article
<%W7Pj.1838$nb4.1052@trnddc08> ...

[...]

> > What's a bit disturbing but not unexpected is the number of sycophants
> > coming out of the benchwork to agree with him, unaware of the flaccid
> > foundation of his arguments.
>
>     Hey, as far as we know, they could be sock puppets...

No, these are some of the Nice Boyz, whose greatest aspirations appear
to be starting vapid threads with oh-so-clever titles.

> What's really
> disturbing is that the Grand Nagus of Model Railroading actually belongs to
> a club...which means there must be some folks that actually want him around.
> <shudder>

Scene from his club:

Vesties: Harrumph! Harrumph! Harrumph! Harrumph! Harrumph!
Bortle: I didn't get a 'harrumph' out of that guy!
Sycophant: Give the Perfect Professor a 'harrumph!'
Newbie: Harrumph!
Bortle: You watch your a.s.

> > I think MR is the only audience he has left.  If the MR mods had any
> > balls, he'd be relegated to donning a sandwich board and yammering on
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> mods that are trying a little too hard (mods should be seen and not
> heard...at least while being a mod).

Yes, they appear to be hell-bent on maintaining the corporate 'fambly
atmosphere' mandate, while neglecting to filter the brain-freezing
stupidity (not ignorance, which can be cured, but vapid nonsense) -- a
characteristic of both the MR and Atlas forums.

> > Here's a New Haven question:  Would any of New Haven's 1937 AAR
> > boxcars (10' H, 4/5 IDE) be seen with the script 'NYNH&H' in the late
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> locos (like one FB-2 here, a few RS-3's there, etc.) never got McGinnis
> paint.  But it would have looked like crap.

It's likely to look like crap anyway, once I get done with it.  Oh,
you mean the New Haven didn't invest much in cleaning/repainting.  
Yeah, I can attest to that, having ridden it between NYC and
Providence many times in college during the '60s.

>     I just tend to use boxcar red, but if you want the right color for sure,
> ask on the NH Forum at www.nhrhta.org.  The guy who writes for the
> "Essential Freight Car" series for RMC is a regular there.  His name is Ted
> Cullota, who owns Speed Witch Media (http://www.speedwitch.com/).  If he
> doesn't know, then probably no one does.  Heck, try sending him an e-mail
> directly from his website.

They're Speedwitch decals that I'm using, and I've corresponded with
him previously.  Really nice guy with great products.  The text with
the decals says 'slightly reddish shade of freight car red' -- and, as
we all know, there is only one true freight car red.

I think I'll just go ahead and use the most toxic XM red I have left
and add a wash of New Haven grime.

Signature

OvC

P. Roehling - 22 Apr 2008 01:35 GMT
> Scene from his club:
>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> Newbie: Harrumph!
> Bortle: You watch your a.s.

Ohhhh, baby; you are so talented! And they are so DUMB!

Pretty funny though.

-pete
Pac Man - 22 Apr 2008 21:37 GMT
> No, these are some of the Nice Boyz, whose greatest aspirations appear
> to be starting vapid threads with oh-so-clever titles.

   The way I figure it, these are the types of people who don't have anyone
to share the hobby with.  IOW, their only hobby social interaction is via
the internet, so they come up with some real time wasters like "What's your
favorite engine?", "Where are you from?", and "Why is there air?"  Stuff
that might take 5 minutes of conversation at a club or a show (or at least
as long as one can get away from such a person), but can drag on for days on
a forum or group.

> Scene from his club:
>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> Newbie: Harrumph!
> Bortle: You watch your a.s.

   "What did you expect? 'Welcome, sonny?' 'Make yourself at home?' 'Marry
my daughter?' You've got to remember that these are just simple modelers.
These are people of the forums. The common clay of the Internet. You know -
morons."

> Yes, they appear to be hell-bent on maintaining the corporate 'fambly
> atmosphere' mandate, while neglecting to filter the brain-freezing
> stupidity (not ignorance, which can be cured, but vapid nonsense) -- a
> characteristic of both the MR and Atlas forums.

   Or just about any discussion group of any kind.  Have you looked around
here, lately?

> It's likely to look like crap anyway, once I get done with it.  Oh,
> you mean the New Haven didn't invest much in cleaning/repainting.
> Yeah, I can attest to that, having ridden it between NYC and
> Providence many times in college during the '60s.

   Invest much?  Try invest any!  LOL  The NH entered bankruptcy in 1961,
IIRC.  They were lucky to get the C425's and U25B's in 1964-5.

> They're Speedwitch decals that I'm using, and I've corresponded with
> him previously.  Really nice guy with great products.  The text with
> the decals says 'slightly reddish shade of freight car red' -- and, as
> we all know, there is only one true freight car red.

   Ted's great.  But I've about tapped my knowledge out for this one.  I
just don't know enough about it.

> I think I'll just go ahead and use the most toxic XM red I have left
> and add a wash of New Haven grime.

   Grime is good.  It prevents rust.  ;-)

Paul A. Cutler III
*************
Weather Or No Go New Haven
*************
Steve Caple - 22 Apr 2008 01:32 GMT
> the flaccid foundation of his arguments.

They have pills for that now.

Signature

Steve

Pac Man - 21 Apr 2008 17:28 GMT
>I live near Cambridge, England. Flying from London to Boston and
> touring New England next month for three weeks. I would like to see
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> there perhaps any permanent exhibitions I could visit? Or maybe
> preserved railroads which happen to have a model?

   Unfortunately, the "exhibitions" (IOW, train shows) here in New England
are in the winter.  From September to April, there's at least one show per
month in Eastern Massachusetts alone.  However, there are no shows that I
know of between April and September.  The largest train show in the country
(over 4 acres of display space), and certainly one of the largest in the
world, is in Springfield, MA in late January/early February.  The rest of
them vary from the tiny (20 tables) to the large (200 tables), with most in
the 100 table range.
   OTOH, there are several museums/tourist lines in the area that are open
during the warmer weather...

In Connecticut, you have:
The Danbury Railroad Museum http://www.danbury.org/drm/ (static displays,
restored station)
The Rail Musuem of New England http://www.rmne.org (tourist train, restored
station, static displays)
The Connecticut Railroad Museum http://www.cteastrrmuseum.org/ (static
displays, rebuilt roundhouse)
The Shore Line Trolley Museum http://www.bera.org/ (trolley rides, static
displays)
The Connecticut Trolley Museum http://www.ceraweb.org./ (trolley rides,
static displays)
The Valley Railroad http://www.essexsteamtrain.com/ (operating steam locos
on tourist train, static displays)

In Massachusetts, you have:
The Old Colony & Fall River Railroad Museum
http://www.ocandfrrailroadmuseum.com/ (static displays, across street from
WWII battleship U.S.S. Massachusetts museum http://www.battleshipcove.org/).
Edaville http://edaville.com/ (operating 2-foot gauge...more for kids these
days).
Cape Cod Central http://www.capetrain.com/ (top notch dinner train, scenic
train, restored station)
Lowell National Historic Park
http://www.railwaypreservation.com/vintagetrolley/lowell.htm (trolley ride)

In Rhode Island, you have:
The Old Colony & Newport http://www.ocnrr.com/ (tourist train)
The Newport Dinner Train http://www.newportdinnertrain.com/ (first rate
dinner train)

In New Hampshire, you have:
The Mt. Washington Cog Railroad http://www.thecog.com/ (steam train climbing
mountain)
The Conway Scenic Railroad http://www.conwayscenic.com/ (steam or diesel
tourist train, restored station, static displays)

In Maine, you have:
Maine Narrow Gauge Railroad http://www.mngrr.org/ (2-foot gauge tourist
train, static displays)
The Maine Eastern Railroad http://www.maineeasternrailroad.com/ (excursion
train, restored station)
The Sandy River & Rangeley Lakes Railroad http://www.srrl-rr.org/ (2-foot
gauge tourist train)
The Wiscasset, Waterville and Farmington Railway http://www.wwfry.org/ 
(2-foot gauge tourist train, static displays, restored stations)

In Vermont, you have:
The Green Mountain Railroad http://www.rails-vt.com/ (mulitple tourist
lines, restored stations)

   As for model railroad clubs, start with these links from the NMRA:
http://www.nmra.org/directory/clubs/clubs-AE.html
http://www.nmra.org/directory/clubs/clubs-FM.html
http://www.nmra.org/directory/clubs/clubs-NR.html
http://www.nmra.org/directory/clubs/clubs-SZ.html

   My club, the South Shore Model Railway Club, is in Hingham, MA
(www.ssmrc.org).  We're open free to the public on every Monday and Thursday
night between 7:00 PM and 11:00 PM (except the first non-holiday Monday of
each month...that's our business meeting).  Trains won't be running too
often before 10pm as it's a work in progress.  We're about 1/3rd built out
of an eventual 6300 sq. ft. HO layout.  You might want to call first so we
know when to listen for the door bell (in a 10,000 sq. ft. building, it's
not easy).
   The other clubs I recommend is the (HO) North Shore Model Railroad Club
in Wakefield, MA (www.nsmrc.org), the (HO) Tech Model Railroad Club of MIT
(http://tmrc.mit.edu/), the multi-gauge Waushakum Live Steamers
(http://www.steamingpriest.com/wls/), and the (multi gauge) Bay State Model
Railroad Museum (http://www.bsmrm.org/).

   Hope this all helps...

Paul A. Cutler III
*************
Weather Or No Go New Haven
*************
David Nebenzahl - 21 Apr 2008 18:07 GMT
On 4/20/2008 3:10 AM Ed Callaghan spake thus:

> I live near Cambridge, England. Flying from London to Boston and
> touring New England next month for three weeks. I would like to see
> some US model railroad layouts but looking at Model Railroader it
> seems you guys don't have exhibitions all over the place as in the UK,
> perhaps because your layouts are mostly too large to transport. Are
> there perhaps any permanent exhibitions I could visit?

I notice that nobody's mentioned George Sellios' Franklin & South
Manchester, which I believe is in or near Boston. It's still open for
visiting, isn't it?

Signature

The best argument against democracy is a five-minute
conversation with the average voter.

- Attributed to Winston Churchill

wkaiser@mtholyoke.edu - 22 Apr 2008 18:26 GMT
Ed Callaghan <callaghan@paston.co.uk> wrote:
> I live near Cambridge, England. Flying from London to Boston and
> touring New England next month for three weeks. I would like to see
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> there perhaps any permanent exhibitions I could visit? Or maybe
> preserved railroads which happen to have a model?

If you get out to western Mass there is the Pioneer Valley Live Steamers.  
Someone is usually there on Sundays.  Website: www.pvls.org

There is the Shulburne Falls Trolley Museum, www.sftm.org  They have a
small layout in the visitors center, but it doesn't run, just shows their
future plans.  The fun at the museum is riding the trolley and/or pumping
the pump car.  It's a small museum, but the people are friendly and
enthusiastic.  

--  
Bill Kaiser
wkaiser@mtholyoke.edu

There are three ways to do a job: good, cheap, and quick.
You can have any two.
A good, cheap job won't be quick.
A good, quick job won't be cheap.
A cheap, quick job won't be good.
Peter W. - 23 Apr 2008 07:52 GMT
> I live near Cambridge, England. Flying from London to Boston and
> touring New England next month for three weeks. I would like to see
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> there perhaps any permanent exhibitions I could visit? Or maybe
> preserved railroads which happen to have a model?

Ed,
too bad that you've just missed "Tour de Chooch". This is a weekend of
visiting nice layouts in private homes.  It is a semi-public event.

Contact me off list ( p e t e s k i 7 AT g m a i l D O T c o m ) and
maybe soomething can be arranged for a visitor from across the pond.

There also are few Model RR clubs in the Boston area.
http://www.nsmrc.org/visit.html  http://www.nsmrc.org/directions.html
http://www.bsmrm.org/
http://www.finescaleminiatures.com/about.html
Also try http://www.masshome.com/railroads.html#Models (lots of broken
links though)

Peteski
 
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