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Model Forum / General / Railroads / May 2008



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Atlas: #%^&*+!!!

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P. Roehling - 02 May 2008 07:34 GMT
Bought a pair of Atlas SD-35s a few years ago, mainly to use them as helpers
on my S.P. ore train because it happened that they ran at the same speeds as
my Overland locos that are usually the primary power. Except for wearing the
plating off some of the drivers in record time, I didn't have any problems
with them until last week when one of them sustained a drive-line failure
and one of it's trucks ceased to function.

So I disassembled it, discovered that one of the Delrin universal joints
next to the motor had snapped in half, dug out the parts list so I could
order a new one from Atlas, and dialed their 800 number.

The nice man there told me that (A) the universals in those locos broke on a
regular basis, so they had redesigned them, (B) they were out of replacement
parts *because* the universals broke on a regular basis, and, (C) they were
not going to be getting in any more of these parts at any time in the
future.

I asked him if their updated drive line components could be adapted to the
ones with the bad universals, and he told me that they didn't interchange as
far as he knew. End of exchange.

This brings up a few questions:

1. Whatever happened to supporting your products?

2. Does Atlas seriously expect everyone who bought one or more of their
SD-35s to throw them away like a used Kleenex when a simple part fails?

3. Anybody out there need a nicely weathered Southern Pacific SD-35
paperweight?

-Pete
Malcolm Donaldson - 02 May 2008 07:55 GMT
Pete,  If you are real quick Northwest Short Line may be able to help you,
but be advised they plan to close down this month.  Fred is retireing after
5- years.
                                                  Malcolm.
> Bought a pair of Atlas SD-35s a few years ago, mainly to use them as helpers
> on my S.P. ore train because it happened that they ran at the same speeds as
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
>
> -Pete
Dale Carlson - 02 May 2008 09:55 GMT
This is certainly bad news. You meant to type "50 years", of course.
There's nothing on the web site mentioning this. Is there no chance
that someone else will take the business over?

Dale

>  Pete,  If you are real quick Northwest Short Line may be able to help you,
>but be advised they plan to close down this month.  Fred is retireing after
>5- years.
Len - 02 May 2008 10:23 GMT
> Bought a pair of Atlas SD-35s a few years ago, mainly to use them as helpers
> on my S.P. ore train because it happened that they ran at the same speeds as
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
>
> -Pete

Any chance the universal joints in the A-Line/PPW 12030 or 12031 kits
could be adapted to your Atlas loco?

Len
P. Roehling - 02 May 2008 19:40 GMT
> Any chance the universal joints in the A-Line/PPW 12030 or 12031 kits
> could be adapted to your Atlas loco?

Dunno. This just happened Tuesday, and I haven't yet had a chance to look
into potential substitutes. But thanks for the suggestion.

-Pete
Wolf Kirchmeir - 02 May 2008 12:50 GMT
[...snip tale of woe...]
> This brings up a few questions:
>
> 1. Whatever happened to supporting your products?

ROTFLMAO.

> 2. Does Atlas seriously expect everyone who bought one or more of their
> SD-35s to throw them away like a used Kleenex when a simple part fails?

You could put them on your display shelf, or gut them and use them as
dummies. Actually, you have a better idea, as your next question shows:

> 3. Anybody out there need a nicely weathered Southern Pacific SD-35
> paperweight?

Hey, that's an idea -- mount the ting on a nice bit of oak or cherry,
attach nicely weathered track, and mount the loco with a screw/bolt from
underneath into the fuel tank. Sell it for a pretty penny at your next
craft show, and offer to custom-build similar stuff for exorbitant
prices. ;-)

> -Pete

Signature

wolf k.

John Fraser - 02 May 2008 15:12 GMT
Good morning Pete;

> Bought a pair of Atlas SD-35s a few years ago, mainly to use them as
> helpers on my S.P. ore train because it happened that they ran at the same
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
>
> -Pete

   Did they do a complete design overhaul in the sense an air cooled engine
now resides in place of an indirect air cooled engine?

Cheers,
John
Jack - 02 May 2008 15:38 GMT
Micro Mark has a drive shaft and universals - not sure they would fit, but
they're pretty much the same as a Stewart drive shaft.

http://www.ares-server.com/Ares/Ares.asp

or keyword:   universal

   Jack
P. Roehling - 02 May 2008 19:43 GMT
> Micro Mark has a drive shaft and universals - not sure they would fit, but
> they're pretty much the same as a Stewart drive shaft.

Yeah, I've seen those and may give them a try. I've yet to measure the Atlas
motor's drive shaft, but I suspect it's probably 2mm., and if it is it would
probably work.

Thanks for the suggestion,

-Pete
Ken Rice - 02 May 2008 23:46 GMT
>Bought a pair of Atlas SD-35s a few years ago, mainly to use them as helpers
>on my S.P. ore train because it happened that they ran at the same speeds as
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
>
>-Pete

That sounds like something they should have a recall for.

I have four of those engines, but I don't use them much so they haven't failed.

Maybe I'll offer them for sale at the next train show.

Signature

Ken Rice -=:=- kennrice (AT) erols (DOT) com
http://users.erols.com/kennrice - Lego Compatible Flex Track,
   Civil War Round Table of DC & Concentration Camp made of Lego bricks
http://members.tripod.com/~kennrice
   Maps of Ultima 7 Parts 1 & 2, Prophecy of the Shadow, Savage Empire,
   Crusaders of Dark Savant & Others.

P. Roehling - 03 May 2008 00:28 GMT
> That sounds like something they should have a recall for.
>
> I have four of those engines, but I don't use them much so they haven't
> failed.
>
> Maybe I'll offer them for sale at the next train show.

If so, try to sell them to someone who you dislike and are never going to
see again. ;-P

-Pete
Bill - 03 May 2008 01:41 GMT
Pete replied...
*** If so, try to sell them to someone who you dislike and are never
going to see again. ;-P
----------------------------------------------------

I like that!

Bill
P. Roehling - 03 May 2008 03:36 GMT
> Pete replied...
> *** If so, try to sell them to someone who you dislike and are never
> going to see again. ;-P
> ----------------------------------------------------
>
> I like that!

It's the same advise I give to customers of mine who've bought a bad guitar
on eBay and are wondering what to do with it.  (Hey, it's better than
painting it white and using it for an ivy planter!)

-Pete
Roger T. - 03 May 2008 06:50 GMT
>>Bought a pair of Atlas SD-35s a few years ago, mainly to use them as
>>helpers
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>>with them until last week when one of them sustained a drive-line failure
>>and one of it's trucks ceased to function.

>>This brings up a few questions:
>>
>>1. Whatever happened to supporting your products?

Substitute Athearn Genisis 4-6-2 and 2-8-2 for Atlas SD-35s and quitcha
whining.

Serriously, you have a good point but nobody these days, except Bachmann
Spectrum, offer full support for their products.

You can send back a 20 year old Botchmann 2-8-0 and for $20.00, they'll send
you their latest DCC ready Spectrum 2-8-0, probably the finest North
American steam model ever built.

Who else offers that support?

--
Cheers

Roger T.
Home of the Great Eastern Railway at:-
http://www.highspeedplus.com/~rogertra/
Latitude:  48° 25' North
Longitude:  123° 21' West
P. Roehling - 03 May 2008 07:28 GMT
> Seriously, you have a good point but nobody these days, except Bachmann
> Spectrum, offer full support for their products.
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> Who else offers that support?

Dunno, but you're right about Bachmann. I bought one of their 3-truck shays
a few years ago, and as soon as I got it out of the box I discovered that
one of the universal joints was broken.

I called Bachmann that same day, and two days later got a padded envelope
that contained not just a replacement universal joint, but enough parts to
essentially rebuild the entire drive train! When I called to tell them that
they'd apparently sent me someone else's order, they said "No, those are for
you. We want you to be happy with your purchase".

I am.

-Pete
Mark Mathu - 04 May 2008 09:41 GMT
> I called Bachmann that same day, and two days later got a padded envelope
> that contained not just a replacement universal joint, but enough parts to
> essentially rebuild the entire drive train! When I called to tell them
> that they'd apparently sent me someone else's order, they said "No, those
> are for you. We want you to be happy with your purchase".

Good for you, good for Bachmann; and good for model railroading as a whole
that Bachmann does this.
Val - 04 May 2008 17:55 GMT
> I called Bachmann that same day, and two days later got a padded envelope
> that contained not just a replacement universal joint, but enough parts to
> essentially rebuild the entire drive train! When I called to tell them
> that they'd apparently sent me someone else's order, they said "No, those
> are for you. We want you to be happy with your purchase".

>Good for you, good for Bachmann; and good for model railroading as a whole
>that Bachmann does this.

As much as we deride Bachmann (in the N-scale world, anyway), I've  got to
say that I've had couple good service experiences like this from them.
Steve Caple - 03 May 2008 07:32 GMT
> Serriously, you have a good point but nobody these days, except Bachmann
> Spectrum, offer full support for their products.
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> Who else offers that support?

Sure as hell not Mickeysoft!

I mean, that diseasel cost a lot less than a copy of Vista, and at least it
didn't break any of his other engines.

Signature

Steve

John Fraser - 03 May 2008 15:27 GMT
>> Serriously, you have a good point but nobody these days, except Bachmann
>> Spectrum, offer full support for their products.
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> it
> didn't break any of his other engines.

   Keeping in mind that Micro-soft paid for the development of its first
IBM PC product (MS-DOS 1), and didn't invent it.  While Bill Gates was a
programmer, he wasn't an engineer.  In the case of Atlas and not unlike
Microsoft, they're gambling on your loyalty.

Cheers,
John
Steve Caple - 03 May 2008 17:22 GMT
>     Keeping in mind that Micro-soft paid for the development of its first
> IBM PC product (MS-DOS 1), and didn't invent it.

Or, rather, bought it and re-sold it (or rights to it) for a big markup.
But Gates and Ballmer are, as far as I know, completely responsible for
Fistula  - er, uh, the gaping wound known as Vista.

PS  -  I just finished reading a thread in another group where a fellow had
his Vista broken  -  or many of his programs that had been running,
miraculously, and after a fashion at that, under Vista   -  after he
installed some Sony-Ericsson phone software.  Remember the Sony music CD's
with DRM software that installed a rootkit virus  -  er, uh, application  -
the first time you played them?

Signature

Steve

Pac Man - 03 May 2008 18:10 GMT
> Bought a pair of Atlas SD-35s a few years ago, mainly to use them as
> helpers on my S.P. ore train because it happened that they ran at the same
> speeds as my Overland locos that are usually the primary power. Except for
> wearing the plating off some of the drivers in record time, I didn't have
> any problems with them until last week when one of them sustained a
> drive-line failure and one of it's trucks ceased to function.

   Any thought to posting this on the Atlas Forum?  You might get more than
a few ideas...

Paul A. Cutler III
*************
Weather Or No Go New Haven
*************
bladeslinger@earthlink.net - 04 May 2008 14:47 GMT

>2. Does Atlas seriously expect everyone who bought one or more of their
>SD-35s to throw them away like a used Kleenex when a simple part fails?
>3. Anybody out there need a nicely weathered Southern Pacific SD-35
>paperweight?


I know this isn't the answer you want to hear, but ever considered
using that model as a background model on your layout?  Just have it
parked on a siding or in a loco terminal or something.  Could you
possibly get a new SD35 in whatever road name you could find
inexpensive and swap the shells?
P. Roehling - 04 May 2008 19:27 GMT
>>2. Does Atlas seriously expect everyone who bought one or more of their
>>SD-35s to throw them away like a used Kleenex when a simple part fails?
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> I know this isn't the answer you want to hear, but ever considered
> using that model as a background model on your layout?

See "paperweight", above.

> Just have it parked on a siding or in a loco terminal or something.

No room.

>  Could you possibly get a new SD35 in whatever road name you could find
> inexpensive and swap the shells?

Sure. But why would I want to buy a locomotive that I *knew* had a
defectively designed drive train that was likely to break down all over
again?

-Pete
bladeslinger@earthlink.net - 05 May 2008 12:52 GMT
>>  Could you possibly get a new SD35 in whatever road name you could find
>> inexpensive and swap the shells?
>
>Sure. But why would I want to buy a locomotive that I *knew* had a
>defectively designed drive train that was likely to break down all over
>again?

I thought you said they'd redesigned the drive, correcting the
problem, but that finding the replacement parts for older units was
hard.  If that's the case, then buy a newer unit and replace the
shell.
P. Roehling - 05 May 2008 20:32 GMT
> >>  Could you possibly get a new SD35 in whatever road name you could
> find inexpensive and swap the shells?
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> hard.  If that's the case, then buy a newer unit and replace the
> shell.

But why would I buy another engine from a company that admittedly marketed a
defective product and then refused to stand behind it when things went
south?

If they'd do it once without apology, they'd certainly do it again!
Geezer - 05 May 2008 14:36 GMT
Every era seems to have its life-limiting issues.  Almost no Dorfan survives
due to disintegration of the die cast alloy they used.  Some batches of
prewar Lionel had similar problems (warped bellies is a common problem on
the O-72 City of Salina sets), as did a lot of postwar John English, and to
a lesser extent Ulrich and early Mantua and Roundhouse.

I find the problem of the plastic era is splitting of drive components made
from the tough Nylon - Delrin - etc. type engineered plastics.  A high
percent of the RoCo made Atlas O scale F-9s I have encountered have cracks
in the axle gears.  It is as if the parts were designed with too tight an
interference fit between the gear and the half axles, and/or these plastics
become more brittle with age.  The crack starts at the axle, but radiates
out through the gear, resulting in one pair of gear teeth with an extra
large spacing that results in a "clunk - clunk - clunk" as it runs (if it
runs).  Fortunately, these F-9s have hubs on the gears, and I have been able
to repair them by putting collars made from K&S nesting brass tube around
the hobs, then reaming out the axle holes for a less tight fit, and
reassembling.  I have had the same problem with a variety of Bachmann
items - a G-gauge trolley and several of the Chinese made split chassis HO
locomotives.  Unfortunately these don't lend themselves to repair.  I have
not found Athearn to have this problem, but they seem to have used a less
exotic plastic for their drive components.

I wonder if the problem 30 years from now with the current generation of
models will be electronic?  (How many people can still read and have
software that can interpret the data on their old 5.25" floppies, or play
8-track tapes?)  If one wants models that will have prolonged service life,
I think brass is the sure bet.  The worst I've found is disintegrated foam
packing that has ruined a couple paint jobs, and dried out rubber tube
couplings between the motor and worm.  Geezer

> Bought a pair of Atlas SD-35s a few years ago, mainly to use them as
> helpers on my S.P. ore train because it happened that they ran at the same
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
>
> -Pete
 
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