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Model Forum / General / Rockets / May 2004Rocket Motor Noise
Does anybody know of a reliable source for sound levels of the various commercially available motors? We have been requested to keep the volume down at our launches. Some of the EJ and a few of the F's really kick up a racket as they fly. So we are trying to figure out which motors we can get away with. Keep the noise down? How stupid is that? Who told you this? Where do you fly? The noise is a pretty hefty part of the fun and experience. Also, I can't imagine any model motor loud enough to actually bother anybody at with proper distances used. Pax > Does anybody know of a reliable source for sound levels of the various > commercially available motors? We have been requested to keep the volume > down at our launches. Some of the EJ and a few of the F's really kick up a > racket as they fly. So we are trying to figure out which motors we can get > away with. Don't agree with it, it's just we have a whiny lawyer who owns a house next to but well outside the confines of a properly sized range. The request came from the conservation commission who grants us the privilege of flying in a town park. We are just trying to be good neighbors. One idea was to keep the really loud stuff until later in the afternoon. > Keep the noise down? How stupid is that? Who told you this? Where do you > fly? [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > racket as they fly. So we are trying to figure out which motors we can get > > away with. > Don't agree with it, it's just we have a whiny lawyer who owns a house > next to but well outside the confines of a properly sized range. The > request came from the conservation commission who grants us the > privilege of flying in a town park. We are just trying to be good > neighbors. One idea was to keep the really loud stuff until later in > the afternoon. See if you can borrow a sound level meter. Take it to a launch, get as close to the whiner's property as you can without entering it, and take some sound level readings during a launch. The best approach I've seen is to then express the results (especially to people who won't understand the significance of the numbers) as comparisons to noise they're likely to be familiar with, as in, "The loudest rocket launch we measured was XX Db, which is about the same as a passenger car driving past your house, or about 1/2 as loud as a bird chirping outside an open window." > > Don't agree with it, it's just we have a whiny lawyer who owns a house > > next to but well outside the confines of a properly sized range. The [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > close to the whiner's property as you can without entering it, and take > some sound level readings during a launch. I have done this, and the readings are quite high :-) At the LCO console at 50' or minimum launch distance, whichever is greater, all the white lightning motors I got readings on briefly pegged the meter at 130 dB. Some motors sounded quite a bit louder than others; it wouldn't surprise me if some of them exceeded 140 dB. The early econojets, as you surmised, are particularly loud. Black Jack motors were much quieter. FWIW, --tc << At the LCO console at 50' or minimum launch distance, whichever is greater, all the white lightning motors I got readings on briefly pegged the meter at 130 dB. Some motors sounded quite a bit louder than others; it wouldn't surprise me if some of them exceeded 140 >> Wow, that's surprising. They sure don't seem that loud. ><< At the LCO console at 50' or minimum launch distance, whichever is >greater, all the white lightning motors I got readings on briefly pegged the meter at >130 dB. Some motors sounded quite a bit louder than others; it wouldn't >surprise me if some of them exceeded 140 >> >Wow, that's surprising. They sure don't seem that loud. Though my son and I fly rockets from time to time, we are not big time rocketeers. I do however has vast experience with model aircraft. First off, it`s very difficult to use a DB meter to measure "noise", the equipment registers sound frequency and "reads" that. Anyone that has "heard" a 2 cycle model aircraft engine knows they are loud when you are within a few feet (even with a muffler). You may get a reading of say 96 db`s on a meter at 9 feet or so, however run a 4 stroker and "listen" to the difference, usually much quieter to the ear yet still running in the high 90`s or 100`s on a decibel meter. Your milage may vary, but you get my point. You can use a decibel meter as a guide, however you must still "listen" with your ears to determine what motors will sound louder or more offending then others. rick markel My Model Aircraft Home Page http://hometown.aol.com/aileron37/index.html > At the LCO console at 50' or minimum launch distance, whichever is > greater, all the white lightning motors I got readings on briefly > pegged the meter at 130 dB. Some motors sounded quite a bit louder > than others; it wouldn't surprise me if some of them exceeded 140 > dB. How loud is it at the edge of the complainers yard ? at 500 feet it should be 90db or much less at 1000 feet it should be much less then 86db, traffic level. that complainer's yard should be at least 500 feet away, or the site's too small. a model airplane 2 cycle engine is about 96db at 9 feet. much louder to the ear then a F20 at 50 feet. are you turning off the PEAK on that meter ? It should be set to average out the sound to get reading that are meaningful. > Keep the noise down? Actually that is a fairly common complaint at active launch sites. Unfortunately since even wimpy Estes motors produce enough noise to generate complaints, the solution is not motor selection, but interface with immediate neighbors. Jerry Voice of experience.  SignatureJerry Irvine, Box 1242, Claremont, California 91711 USA Opinion, the whole thing. <mail to:01rocket@gte.net> Please bring common sense back to rocketry administration. Produce then publish. http://www.usrockets.com My articles valuable? Donate http://tinyurl.com/2hmgv > > Keep the noise down? > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Voice of experience. This should be in the FAQ. SignatureJerry Irvine, Box 1242, Claremont, California 91711 USA Opinion, the whole thing. <mail to:01rocket@gte.net> Please bring common sense back to rocketry administration. Produce then publish. http://www.usrockets.com My articles valuable? Donate http://tinyurl.com/2hmgv << Also, I can't imagine any model motor loud enough to actually bother anybody at with proper distances used. >> Yeah, even a G80 seems pretty quiet from a little distance, but then I've gotten so used to big motors over the year that modrocs seem really quiet to me anyway. If there are horses in the area, noise could be a concern. I've seen horses get spooked by modrocs even at a quarter mile distant. We got bounced from our prior field because an N2000 amd 3-K700's startled some cows on a field almost a mile away. Just pi$$er$ and moaner$ anyhow... Get a sound meter & compare it to emergency vehicles' sirens, weed wackers, lawn mower & leaf blowers. That coupled with the fact that most motors only make nosie for a second or two shold help. >Does anybody know of a reliable source for sound levels of the various >commercially available motors? We have been requested to keep the volume >down at our launches. Some of the EJ and a few of the F's really kick up a >racket as they fly. So we are trying to figure out which motors we can get >away with. Anytime I do something loud, I fire up the leafblower and let it run. If they're going to complain, it will be about that noise, and it's not one the cops will do anything about. Joel. phx Does the lawyer have a barking dog? > Get a sound meter & compare it to emergency vehicles' sirens, weed > wackers, lawn mower & leaf blowers. That coupled with the fact that [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >racket as they fly. So we are trying to figure out which motors we can get > >away with. > Anytime I do something loud, I fire up the leafblower and let it run. If > they're going to complain, it will be about that noise, and it's not one the > cops will do anything about. Selective enforcement proven once again! > Joel. phx > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > get > > >away with. SignatureJerry Irvine, Box 1242, Claremont, California 91711 USA Opinion, the whole thing. <mail to:01rocket@gte.net> Please bring common sense back to rocketry administration. Produce then publish. http://www.usrockets.com My articles valuable? Donate http://tinyurl.com/2hmgv It's not selective enforcement by the cops. There are sound ordinances that are effective for certain times of the day. There's nothing that can be done about running a leaf blower till they run it past a certain hour. It differs from city to city. The launch site is a different story because they have a land owner to keep happy and in tune with the surrounding neighbors. > > Anytime I do something loud, I fire up the leafblower and let it run. If > > they're going to complain, it will be about that noise, and it's not one the [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > get > > > >away with. > It's not selective enforcement by the cops. There are sound ordinances that > are effective for certain times of the day. There's nothing that can be done > about running a leaf blower till they run it past a certain hour. It differs > from city to city. The launch site is a different story because they have a > land owner to keep happy and in tune with the surrounding neighbors. Be careful Chad, you will confuse Jerry with facts of reality.(:-) Fred I'm sure next he inform me how the police system works and he invented it. > > It's not selective enforcement by the cops. There are sound ordinances that > > are effective for certain times of the day. There's nothing that can be done [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Fred > > It's not selective enforcement by the cops. There are sound ordinances that > > are effective for certain times of the day. There's nothing that can be done [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Fred You are actively harassing me now. Jerry SignatureJerry Irvine, Box 1242, Claremont, California 91711 USA Opinion, the whole thing. <mail to:01rocket@gte.net> Please bring common sense back to rocketry administration. Produce then publish. http://www.usrockets.com My articles valuable? Donate http://tinyurl.com/2hmgv Who? Hope it's not me. > > > It's not selective enforcement by the cops. There are sound ordinances that > > > are effective for certain times of the day. There's nothing that can be done [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Jerry > > > It's not selective enforcement by the cops. There are sound ordinances that > > > are effective for certain times of the day. There's nothing that can be done [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Jerry Would you like some whine with that 40K cheese?? BTW, your always talking about serving certain folks if they would just ID themselves; You know who I am and you have my address; make a stand, 40 grand to the man; lost on appeal -- hey, what the deal?? Fred Is it possible to inactively harass someone? 8-) >You are actively harassing me now. > >Jerry > Is it possible to inactively harass someone? 8-) I'm doing that right now. (homer simpson with furrowed brow) steve > It's not selective enforcement by the cops. There are sound ordinances that > are effective for certain times of the day. There's nothing that can be done > about running a leaf blower till they run it past a certain hour. It differs > from city to city. The launch site is a different story because they have a > land owner to keep happy and in tune with the surrounding neighbors. Here's a radical idea. Hand out fliers to the neighbors inviting them to watch with free ice-cream for the kids. Ask at the grocery if they have any sort of donation programs. Couple of clipboards with "we support this activity" for neighbor signatures. "These neighbors are fine with the activity, but we will limit the motors to 'x' to keep the one neighbor happy". Set up a soccer game of 5 year olds on a Saturday morning. He'll be begging for you to come back. Joel. phx DING-DING-DING Ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls. We have a winner in the let's find a way to turn our disadvantage into a positive without having to do anything illegal, immoral, although fattening is up for grabs because tofu hotdogs are just plain wrong. . Gee Joel, that is a great idea! A > > It's not selective enforcement by the cops. There are sound ordinances > that [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Joel. phx Yep, especially the free ice cream for the kids: legal, moral, _and_ fattening! -dave w > DING-DING-DING > [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > > > > Joel. phx Sounds like pretty sound PR... > > It's not selective enforcement by the cops. There are sound ordinances > that [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Joel. phx someone grips about the bit of sound from a model rocket engine? How about the sound levels of a football / baseball game? or RC Airplanes? SignatureDragons Must Fly when Thread's in the Sky www.starlords.org > Does anybody know of a reliable source for sound levels of the various > commercially available motors? We have been requested to keep the volume > down at our launches. Some of the EJ and a few of the F's really kick up a > racket as they fly. So we are trying to figure out which motors we can get > away with. > Does anybody know of a reliable source for sound levels of the various > commercially available motors? We have been requested to keep the volume > down at our launches. Some of the EJ and a few of the F's really kick up a > racket as they fly. So we are trying to figure out which motors we can get > away with. Noise levels of rockets may be difficult to compare with other types of noise. The main "uniqueness" of rockets (especially high power) is the sudden and startling nature of the noise. Your neighbors may have a problem with the suprise of the noise (yes, I know, a firearm or pyrotechnic display is much louder, but let's stay focused here...) rather than any problem with the decibel level. As had been mentioned in this thread elsewhere, good PR is your best option. Notify the surrounding area of a sport launch for that day, invite the neighbors to watch a few rounds, etc. My wife (a community nurse specializing in infants and toddlers) has noticed the effect on small children: the noise of the higher power motors can be an unpleasent experience on sensitive ears. Parents should be aware of this possibility and consider options such as hearing protection and talking the child through the event. Fred Williams (No celebrity impersonators were harmed in the production of this message. Your mileage and side effects may vary.) > of noise. The main "uniqueness" of rockets (especially high power) is > the sudden and startling nature of the noise. I agree. SignatureJerry Irvine, Box 1242, Claremont, California 91711 USA Opinion, the whole thing. <mail to:01rocket@gte.net> Please bring common sense back to rocketry administration. Produce then publish. http://www.usrockets.com My articles valuable? Donate http://tinyurl.com/2hmgv > > of noise. The main "uniqueness" of rockets (especially high power) is > > the sudden and startling nature of the noise. > > I agree. Also, the sound is uncommonly rich in high-frequency "white noise". -dave w |
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