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Model Forum / General / Rockets / June 2004Ejection Charge
Has anyone ever heard of or considered the possibility of using Sodium Azide as an ejection charge? This is the explosive used in airbags. According to my reading it only requires an electric current to react extremely violently and give off a whole bunch of nitrogen. Just a note: If this is new to you and you are thinking "let's give it a whirl" read up. Apparently it can be very poisonous (along the lines of sodium cyanide) A > Has anyone ever heard of or considered the possibility of using Sodium > Azide as an ejection charge? This is the explosive used in airbags. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > whirl" read up. Apparently it can be very poisonous (along the lines of > sodium cyanide) You're right about the poisonous bit. It's also, I believe, way too sensitive for me to feel comfortable handling it, and you would need a high explosive user permit to buy any. -dave w I was not aware you needed a permit. Some of my reading said it was also used in agriculture as a rat poison. Twitchy, yes. The idea sprang from the fact that most of us drive to and from work with a small amount about a foot from their chest. I have pillar and curtain airbags, so I'm surrounded with the stuff... A > > Has anyone ever heard of or considered the possibility of using Sodium > > Azide as an ejection charge? This is the explosive used in airbags. [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > -dave w > Twitchy, yes. The idea sprang from the fact that most of us drive to and > from work with a small amount about a foot from their chest. I have pillar > and curtain airbags, so I'm surrounded with the stuff... I think it is kinda gruesome but some folks report good results making parachute protectors out of air bag material. you can find plenty of popped bags at the auto parts recyclers. my new car has 6 airbags. I sure wish it had 4 or 5 point belts too!! > my new car has 6 airbags. I sure wish it had 4 or 5 point belts too!! Yeah really... I especially hate the "inertia reel" style belts... if I can't cinch it up comfortably, I feel weird (like my shoelaces were tied wrong)... -dave w >>my new car has 6 airbags. I sure wish it had 4 or 5 point belts too!! > > Yeah really... I especially hate the "inertia reel" style belts... if I can't > cinch it up comfortably, I feel weird (like my shoelaces were tied wrong)... I've never had an accident (other than backing the truck in to the birch tree in the front yard - duh!) so don't know much about how that stuff actually works. but a few times under hard braking the inertia belts have locked and that made me feel better about them. that said, I really hate the GM style racheting belts - makes me feel like I am getting strangled!! > >>my new car has 6 airbags. I sure wish it had 4 or 5 point belts too!! > > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > really hate the GM style racheting belts - makes me feel like I am > getting strangled!! Passenger car seat belts seem to have become an example of the "can't leave well enough alone" school of design: we've got all these ratchet retractors and inertia reels and stuff... What's wrong with the old style, where you snap the tab into the buckle and then pull the thing tight by pulling on the end, and then it stays like that until you adjust it? -dave w For a lap belt, that works OK, but for a shoulder harness you need slack for normal driving and reaching (CD player/radio, air conditioner controls, etc.). An inertia reel is the answer. ALSO, many inDUHviduals will not use their belts, since they "know" they can simply brace themselves with their arm if they have a collision. After many decades of dead and mutilated stupid drivers and passengers we now have restraint systems that are self adjusting and must be engaged (or else you get the annoying chime or buzzer). And then there's the "Click-it or Ticket" national campaign. -Fred "5 point" Shecter NAR 20117  Signature"""Remove "zorch" from address (2 places) to reply. > > > > >>my new car has 6 airbags. I sure wish it had 4 or 5 point belts too!! [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > -dave w << For a lap belt, that works OK, but for a shoulder harness you need slack for normal driving and reaching (CD player/radio, air conditioner controls, etc.). An inertia reel is the answer. >> Yep. I've been in a few accidents and the inertia belts always worked fine. I've got your MA-16 right here, buddy. http://www.hkoch.com/ma-16.cfm -Fred Shecter NAR 20117 http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewSellersOtherItems&userid=shreadvector Signature"""Remove "zorch" from address (2 places) to reply. > > Twitchy, yes. The idea sprang from the fact that most of us drive to and > > from work with a small amount about a foot from their chest. I have pillar [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > my new car has 6 airbags. I sure wish it had 4 or 5 point belts too!! > I was not aware you needed a permit. Some of my reading said it was also > used in agriculture as a rat poison. I suspect that for such use, it's distributed in a diluted form (as in rat bait pellets spiked with something like a percent or so of the stuff) to mitigate the risk of explosion. (The remains of the rats are easier to rem > Twitchy, yes. The idea sprang from the fact that most of us drive to and > from work with a small amount about a foot from their chest. I have pillar > and curtain airbags, so I'm surrounded with the stuff... Yep, and it's all in special sealed premanufactured charges down inside the "canned" single-use airbag assembly... not something I'd want to use directly as ejection powder, that's for sure... -dave w > A > > > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > > > -dave w > > I was not aware you needed a permit. Some of my reading said it was also > > used in agriculture as a rat poison. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > to mitigate the risk of explosion. (The remains of the rats are easier to > rem --- oops --- premature send, there... I was going to say: "... easier to remove if they are just poisoned in one piece instead of dispersed as rat shrapnel.)" -dw > > Twitchy, yes. The idea sprang from the fact that most of us drive to and > > from work with a small amount about a foot from their chest. I have pillar [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > > > > > > -dave w There is a thought...Varmint Land Mines. Something for Caddyshack 5? > > > I was not aware you needed a permit. Some of my reading said it was also > > > used in agriculture as a rat poison. [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > > > > > > > > -dave w > There is a thought...Varmint Land Mines. Something for Caddyshack 5? Cinderella story,.... Came out of nowhere.... >>There is a thought...Varmint Land Mines. Something for Caddyshack 5? > > Cinderella story,.... Came out of nowhere.... "It's in the hole!" http://www.wavcentral.com/movies/caddshk.html A true cinematic viewing extravaganza :) Perfect timing as I'll be doing loops for my bud this weekend in a tourney. Ted 'no bare feet' Novak TRA#5512 > You're right about the poisonous bit. It's also, I believe, way too > sensitive for me to feel comfortable handling it, and you would need > a high explosive user permit to buy any. TRW on the other end of town seems to take out a few employees every couple of years. Last one I remember they were working on a dust hood and sparks set off the dust inside the hood. Good luck playing with it. Joel. phx > -dave w After reading that the stuff could kill you if you mixed it with: Water Alcohol Other metals Air Vacuum etc. I was not planning on it. Just wondering if anybody else has. > > You're right about the poisonous bit. It's also, I believe, way too > > sensitive for me to feel comfortable handling it, and you would need [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > > -dave w > Has anyone ever heard of or considered the possibility of using Sodium > Azide as an ejection charge? This is the explosive used in airbags. > According to my reading it only requires an electric current to react > extremely violently and give off a whole bunch of nitrogen. Where would the electric current come from? SignatureKurt Weber kmw@armory.com Same place we get it for other methods? One wild variable is how much current is required. I realize that a car battery has several hundred amps available, however, I wonder if there is an auxiliary source in automobile applications as is an accident the 12V power might be disrupted before the charge fires. I wonder if a capacitor could store enough energy,,, I know one source that could: a Polapulse battery. I've vaporized a paperclip with those. Aside from curiosity, the other thing that piqued my interest was the difficulty I am having in locating ffffg. A > > Has anyone ever heard of or considered the possibility of using Sodium > > Azide as an ejection charge? This is the explosive used in airbags. > > According to my reading it only requires an electric current to react > > extremely violently and give off a whole bunch of nitrogen. > > Where would the electric current come from? > Same place we get it for other methods? One wild variable is how much > current is required. I realize that a car battery has several hundred amps > available, however, I wonder if there is an auxiliary source in automobile > applications as is an accident the 12V power might be disrupted before the > charge fires. I wonder if a capacitor could store enough energy,,, It could; however, you'd still have to have some way of preventing it from discharging until you're ready to set off the charge. And, of course, if it's an electrolytic capacitor you have to make sure you don't wire it up backwards; otherwise, it (a) won't work and (b) might explode. Carrying batteries up isn't too bright an idea, either--when something goes horribly wrong, I don't think I want battery guts raining down on me. And you still have the problem of switching the current on at the precise instant you want it to. SignatureKurt Weber kmw@armory.com >>thing that piqued my interest was the difficulty I am having in locating ffffg. go to a gun store that sells lots of real guns , and flint locks and stuff. what state are you in that BP is real hard to find ? BP is almost a right, some states try to limit. > Same place we get it for other methods? One wild variable is how much > current is required. I realize that a car battery has several hundred amps [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > > > Where would the electric current come from? I live in Connecticut. I've been to about a dozen firearms stores. - they all sell Pyrodex, smokeless, and several sell fffg. Each tell me that the explosives permit they need to keep ffffg on hand is not worth the volume of sales. > >>thing that piqued my interest was the > difficulty I am having in locating ffffg. [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > > > > > > Where would the electric current come from? > I live in Connecticut. I've been to about a dozen firearms stores. - they > all sell Pyrodex, smokeless, and several sell fffg. Each tell me that the > explosives permit they need to keep ffffg on hand is not worth the volume of > sales. The 3F (fffg) grade should be also usable for ejection. (They need a _different_ permit for the 4F stuff? That sounds just a bit odd!) -dave w Dunno Right now I'm working up my L2 Sudden Rush CP3K. There has been mucho discussion on 3f vs 4f. The running sentiment is that 3f will work if you pack it in good and fill any void with wadding BTW the Sodium Azide idea was more of a rocket-geek brain fart, than anything else. Having reviewed the pertinent info, this stuff has bad written all over it. > > I live in Connecticut. I've been to about a dozen firearms stores. - they > > all sell Pyrodex, smokeless, and several sell fffg. Each tell me that the [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > -dave w Al G. wrote: << There has been mucho discussion on 3f vs 4f. The running sentiment is that 3f will work if you pack it in good and fill any void with wadding >> 3F is fine. I've used both, no special treatment and no noticeable difference in the results. Great! Last thing I wanted to do was trash a $300 rocket because I had something so simple as the wrong grade of BP for a proper ejection. > Al G. wrote: > << There has been mucho discussion on 3f vs 4f. The running sentiment is that > 3f will work if you pack it in good and fill any void with wadding >> > > 3F is fine. I've used both, no special treatment and no noticeable difference > in the results. > Dunno > > Right now I'm working up my L2 Sudden Rush CP3K. There has been mucho > discussion on 3f vs 4f. The running sentiment is that 3f will work if you > pack it in good and fill any void with wadding I've used both 3f and 4f. with either I pack the charge cannon with wadding real tight. I use cardboard tubes for the charge cannon so it can split, pvc and metal charge cannons have been known to blow holes in the sides of body tubes sometimes. Permits for BP where I am at are the same for 2,3 or 4f. > BTW the Sodium Azide idea was more of a rocket-geek brain fart, than > anything else. Having reviewed the pertinent info, this stuff has bad [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > > > -dave w > >>thing that piqued my interest was the > difficulty I am having in locating ffffg. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > BP is almost a right, some states try to limit. Even California allows individuals to possess small amounts of ordinary household gunpowder (5 lbs. of BP or 20 lbs. of smokeless) without special requirements. It's in the state explosives regulations as a specific exemption. Dealers have specific storage and recordkeeping requirements for commercial stocks of BP... when you buy it, they have to get it from the Special Storage Locker somewhere in the back of the store, and you need to record your name and address (and date and amount purchased) in the seller's inventory logbook. -dave w > > >>thing that piqued my interest was the > > difficulty I am having in locating ffffg. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > small amounts of ordinary household gunpowder > (5 lbs. of BP or 20 lbs. of smokeless) without CSFM claims it is 1 pound max. But won't say why. > special requirements. It's in the state explosives > regulations as a specific exemption. Dealers have [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > -dave w SignatureJerry Irvine, Box 1242, Claremont, California 91711 USA Opinion, the whole thing. <mail to:01rocket@gte.net> Please bring common sense back to rocketry administration. Produce then publish. http://www.usrockets.com My articles valuable? Donate http://tinyurl.com/2hmgv > > >>thing that piqued my interest was the > > difficulty I am having in locating ffffg. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Even California allows individuals to possess > small amounts of ordinary household gunpowder Am I the only one here who finds the term "ordinary household gunpowder" a little alarming? > (5 lbs. of BP or 20 lbs. of smokeless) without > special requirements. It's in the state explosives [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > -dave w >Am I the only one here who finds the term "ordinary household gunpowder" a >little alarming? If that scares you should see what we have stored in our 5 gallon gas cans. Talk about an explosive potential! Oh yeah? Try this on for a garage. 5 gallons of gas 2 cars about 40 rattle cans of paint A live in mom who has "quit smoking" - really Oh yeah...100# of liquid oxygen for mom's emphysema We gonna go boom one day.... > >Am I the only one here who finds the term "ordinary household gunpowder" a > >little alarming? [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Talk about an explosive potential! > Oh yeah? > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > We gonna go boom one day.... Don't worry, I doubt you'll feel a thing! But the neighbors might get pissed! > Am I the only one here who finds the term "ordinary household gunpowder" a > little alarming? I find it amusing. I learned of BP the first time when askin' gran pap about the can in the Ge-rage. BP is a staple of freedom, and help secure it some 228 years ago. Back then, George would'nt let us have large BP factories, as he knew they could be used to secure freedom from him. > > Am I the only one here who finds the term "ordinary household gunpowder" a > > little alarming? [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Back then, George would'nt let us have large BP factories, as he knew they > could be used to secure freedom from him. Why do so many people "naturally assume" people suddenly cannot be trusted with gunpowder, despite 230 years of constant usage with franlky lower average intelligence in the past. Or do we just want to make things MORE CONVENIENT for police? Hmmm? Jerry SignatureJerry Irvine, Box 1242, Claremont, California 91711 USA Opinion, the whole thing. <mail to:01rocket@gte.net> Please bring common sense back to rocketry administration. Produce then publish. http://www.usrockets.com My articles valuable? Donate http://tinyurl.com/2hmgv >> > >>thing that piqued my interest was the >> > difficulty I am having in locating ffffg. [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >Am I the only one here who finds the term "ordinary household gunpowder" a >little alarming? It's in the spice rack next to the plutonium. If you add Coke C2 plus C2 you get... > "british guy" wrote: > > > Even California allows individuals to possess [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > It's in the spice rack next to the plutonium. LOL! -dave w > It's in the spice rack next to the plutonium. If you add Coke C2 plus > C2 you get... It's all usless without the U-238 space modulator. Delays! Delays! Randy > Am I the only one here who finds the term "ordinary household gunpowder" a > little alarming? You mean, You don't have any "household gunpowder"? ;) If you don't have any household gunpowder, how do you get rid of the gophers? SignatureChristopher Brian Deem NAR 12308 TRA 2256 Level II > > > Am I the only one here who finds the term "ordinary household gunpowder" a > > little alarming? > > You mean, You don't have any "household gunpowder"? ;) See, how if you would have read the entire thread, you would have realized that Sodium Azide is what you should use. It's really versatile... You can either blow them into gopher puree or just poison them... <TESG> A > If you don't have any household gunpowder, how do you get rid of the > gophers? [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > > > You mean, You don't have any "household gunpowder"? ;) Defective propellant grains. >If you don't have any household gunpowder, how do you get rid of the >gophers? > If you don't have any household gunpowder, how do you get rid of the > gophers? LOL >>If you don't have any household gunpowder, how do you get rid of the >>gophers? > > LOL We launc..oops er, send'em to Washington D.C. to pester our finest political hacks.. Er Senators! Rich > small amounts of ordinary household gunpowder I love it Dave, a new buzz word. "ordinary household gunpowder" > > small amounts of ordinary household gunpowder > > I love it Dave, a new buzz word. > > "ordinary household gunpowder" just like a "regular domestic assault-rifle" i suppose.... > just like a "regular domestic assault-rifle" i suppose.... Well, I would say "regular domestic rifle". Many homes have their domestic rifle in them. Places like Finland have them in every home you know. Keeps that country very peaceful and never invaded successfully. the word assault has been improperly used by gun control activists to control guns that have no use in crime, yet are useful for other uses. when was the last time you saw bank robbers (in the USA) with mounted bayonets, yet a bayonet mount is cited as a "buzz item" on an assault rifle. I seem to detect an anti-gun note in your posts, and as such, this will be my last posting on the subject, as I do not wish to argue. those who wish to learn more may find this useful: http://www.nraila.org/ >Places like Finland have them in every home you know. >Keeps that country very peaceful and never invaded successfully. Do you mean Switzerland? SignatureDarren J Longhorn http://www.geocities.com/darrenlonghorn/ NSRG #005 http://www.northstarrocketry.org.uk/ UKRA #1094 L2 RSO http://www.ukra.org.uk/ > >Places like Finland have them in every home you know. > >Keeps that country very peaceful and never invaded successfully. > > Do you mean Switzerland? both do the same thing, I do belive ? >> >Places like Finland have them in every home you know. >> >Keeps that country very peaceful and never invaded successfully. >> >> Do you mean Switzerland? > >both do the same thing, I do belive ? Well I don't know about the Fins keeping guns at home, but they've certainly been invaded regularly over the years. SignatureDarren J Longhorn http://www.geocities.com/darrenlonghorn/ NSRG #005 http://www.northstarrocketry.org.uk/ UKRA #1094 L2 RSO http://www.ukra.org.uk/ > Well I don't know about the Fins keeping guns at home, but they've > certainly been invaded regularly over the years. Ok I give by who ? pre rifle era would not count, I assume. I also found this : http://www.gesource.ac.uk/worldguide/html/882.html During World War II, it was able to successfully defend its freedom and resist invasions by the Soviet Union - albeit with some loss of territory the loss of territory must be from the Evacuation of Karelia >> Well I don't know about the Fins keeping guns at home, but they've >> certainly been invaded regularly over the years. > >Ok I give by who ? > >pre rifle era would not count, I assume. Ah, good point! I knew that Finland was pretty much part of Sweden, but periodically occupied by the Russians: during the Great Northern War (1714-21) & the "War of the Hats" (1741-43). Pre-rifle? Not sure, probably. But then the Russians invaded again in 1808, and after 1809 Finland didn't become truly independent until 1917. When was the rifle invented again? ;-) >I also found this : >http://www.gesource.ac.uk/worldguide/html/882.html > During World War II, it was able to successfully defend its freedom and >resist invasions by the Soviet Union - albeit with some loss of territory >the loss of territory must be from the Evacuation of Karelia I'd call that a score-draw rather than a definite win for the Fins. 400000 people lost their homes, and Finland stayed vaguely under the Soviet sphere of influence (forced into strict "neutrality", pledged to defend the Soviet Union against any German aggression, prevented from participating in the Marshall Plan) for several decades afterwards. I still think Switzerland is a better example, truly independent since the Treaty of Westphalia ended the Thirty Years War in 1648. SignatureDarren J Longhorn http://www.geocities.com/darrenlonghorn/ NSRG #005 http://www.northstarrocketry.org.uk/ UKRA #1094 L2 RSO http://www.ukra.org.uk/ > just like a "regular domestic assault-rifle" i suppose.... Do you know the difference between a "regular domestic assault-rifle" and an ordinary hunting rifle? Doug >>just like a "regular domestic assault-rifle" i suppose.... > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Doug This is a trick question right? :) >Do you know the difference between a "regular >domestic assault-rifle" and an ordinary hunting >rifle? Of course he doesn't. He's British. We could walk over right now and screw his wife and there isn't squat he could do about it. Thank goodness we got rid of the British when we did. > >Do you know the difference between a "regular > >domestic assault-rifle" and an ordinary hunting > >rifle? > > Of course he doesn't. He's British. A misguided and wholly inaccurate assumption > We could walk over right now and > screw his wife and there isn't squat he could do about it. The idea of "walking over" is not worth commenting on further as the double negative is a perfect demonstration of your intellectual inadequacy. > Thank goodness we got rid of the British when we did. OMG > "RoCkeT FlyA" <newtons@desr.com> wrote in message > The idea of "walking over" is not worth commenting on further as the double > negative is a perfect demonstration of your intellectual inadequacy. He insists on demonstrating his intellectual capacity everyday. Just like Ray and Stein and Teeling/Grayvis. Jerry SignatureJerry Irvine, Box 1242, Claremont, California 91711 USA Opinion, the whole thing. <mail to:01rocket@gte.net> Please bring common sense back to rocketry administration. Produce then publish. http://www.usrockets.com My articles valuable? Donate http://tinyurl.com/2hmgv Jerry - This proves you're our bitch. You can't stop thinking about us. Don't piss us off or we'll stop being nice to you. >> "RoCkeT FlyA" <newtons@desr.com> wrote in message > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >Jerry >He insists on demonstrating his intellectual capacity everyday. Just >like Ray and Stein and Teeling/Grayvis. Sit down and shut up you $40,000 loser. > > just like a "regular domestic assault-rifle" i suppose.... > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Doug You can kill more things quicker with an assault rifle? >>>just like a "regular domestic assault-rifle" i suppose.... >> [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > You can kill more things quicker with an assault rifle? We're talking gophers, right? > You can kill more things quicker with an assault rifle? Nope. They're both semi-automatic rifles. The rate of fire is however fast the user can repeatedly pull the trigger. Try again. Doug >> > just like a "regular domestic assault-rifle" i suppose.... >> [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >You can kill more things quicker with an assault rifle? British Guy Sure, but only if they're fairly small things:-). Hunting rifles are generally FAR more powerful than Assult rifles. .223's would probably just get the bigger animals mad at you. 9mm are more like a mosquito bite:-)! Lloyd However, there is always a beautiful exception... to wit: http://www.barrettrifles.com/military.htm > >> > just like a "regular domestic assault-rifle" i suppose.... > >> [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > Lloyd >However, there is always a beautiful exception... > >to wit: http://www.barrettrifles.com/military.htm Which was termed "terrorists weapon of choice" by some moronic member of the Senate, and has Chuckie Schumer authorizing bills banning it . anyone saying "criminal or terrorist weapon of choice" should be roundly beaten about the head and shoulders unless they can show actual cases of usage, not chicken little stuff. And the .223 round was banned in a number of states for deer hunting, since it was considered not powerful enough to kill deer humanely, only wound them, which is the military intent of that small a round anyway. > >However, there is always a beautiful exception... > > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > roundly beaten about the head and shoulders unless they can show > actual cases of usage, not chicken little stuff. GFL "The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be lead to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary." - H.L. Mencken (1880-1956) > And the .223 round was banned in a number of states for deer hunting, > since it was considered not powerful enough to kill deer humanely, > only wound them, which is the military intent of that small a round > anyway. SignatureJerry Irvine, Box 1242, Claremont, California 91711 USA Opinion, the whole thing. <mail to:01rocket@gte.net> Please bring common sense back to rocketry administration. Produce then publish. http://www.usrockets.com My articles valuable? Donate http://tinyurl.com/2hmgv > > just like a "regular domestic assault-rifle" i suppose.... > > Do you know the difference between a "regular > domestic assault-rifle" and an ordinary hunting > rifle? The target selected by the user? -dave w >>>thing that piqued my interest was the >> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > BP is almost a right, some states try to limit. Some folks in the US Senate would like to limit it as well: http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?c108:6:./temp/~c108lMMVEc:: Notice that Section 6 of this act would reduce the BP exemption from 50 pounds to 5. But I think that this bill is dead. SignatureDavid W. Schultz http://home.earthlink.net/~david.schultz > Some folks in the US Senate would like to limit it as well: > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > But I think that this bill is dead. I assume the nation's friends in the NRA helped to kill the bill. > Aside from curiosity, the other thing that piqued my interest was the > difficulty I am having in locating ffffg. Then use fffg. Your 'chutes won't be able to tell the difference. I recommend you go to smokeless powder before you start playing with high explosives. I think you're heading toward the wrong side of the accessability and functionality issue. -Scott Based on my reading, and Ray's comment, I'm dropping this idea like so many others I've had. If fffg will suffice, I am set. As I said above, I've already dropped this idea. The stuff is way too unstable, and just downright toxic. While fascinating to consider, It has no merit in a rocketry application. A > > Aside from curiosity, the other thing that piqued my interest was the > > difficulty I am having in locating ffffg. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > explosives. I think you're heading toward the wrong side of the > accessability and functionality issue. -Scott >Subject: Re: Ejection Charge >From: "Al Gloer" al_gloer@cox.net >Date: 6/26/04 7:16 AM Central Daylight Time >Based on my reading, and Ray's comment, I'm dropping this idea like so many >others I've had. If fffg will suffice, I am set. Been using FFFG for years with nary a problem. You'll be alright.. Pat G We looked into the possibility of making a single use airbag based ejection charge but the costs at the time were prohibitive. The CO2 ejection system CD3 you can buy from Rouse-Tech is very expensive but only about a tenth of the cost of the airbag in quantities we need in this sport. Now if there were 1.7 to 1.8 million users for the product, we could drive the cost down under $50 each charge but still, that is not a good thing to pour money into for research when a half penny's worth of FFFG will work just fine... Cool ideas may eventually become marketable. Not sure this will unless we greatly expand the hobby. Barry > Has anyone ever heard of or considered the possibility of using Sodium > Azide as an ejection charge? This is the explosive used in airbags. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > A > Cool ideas may eventually become marketable. Not sure this will unless we > greatly expand the hobby. Greatly expanding the hobby strikes fear in the hearts of NAR and TRA leadership because such a thing could nit be controlled with an iron fist like 2500 people stupid enough to subscribe to HPR magazine, and apply for ATF permits for exempt PADs, are. Jerry SignatureJerry Irvine, Box 1242, Claremont, California 91711 USA Opinion, the whole thing. <mail to:01rocket@gte.net> Please bring common sense back to rocketry administration. Produce then publish. http://www.usrockets.com My articles valuable? Donate http://tinyurl.com/2hmgv >Greatly expanding the hobby strikes fear in the hearts of NAR and TRA >leadership because such a thing could nit be controlled with an iron >fist like 2500 people stupid enough to subscribe to HPR magazine, and >apply for ATF permits for exempt PADs, are. You got a $40,000 fine? Holy sh.t! You must be an idiot! Big Fine wrote: << Greatly expanding the hobby strikes fear in the hearts of NAR and TRA leadership because such a thing could nit be controlled with an iron fist like 2500 people stupid enough to subscribe to HPR magazine, and apply for ATF permits for exempt PADs, are. >> Jerry, sit down and shut up. > Big Fine wrote: Insert any valid point. > Jerry, sit down and shut up. Impressive. Jerry "The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be lead to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary." - H.L. Mencken (1880-1956) and :) "And of course always remember: What your ATF inspector says is true, nothing else matters. Not the Orange Book, not physics, not logic, and not the law." - Tony Alcocer "Cheer up, they said, things could be worse. So we cheered up and they were right - it got worse." SignatureJerry Irvine, Box 1242, Claremont, California 91711 USA Opinion, the whole thing. <mail to:01rocket@gte.net> Please bring common sense back to rocketry administration. Produce then publish. http://www.usrockets.com My articles valuable? Donate http://tinyurl.com/2hmgv >Impressive. Convicted felon? $40,000 fines? Looks like an idiot in court? Who can we possibly be talking about??? > >Impressive. > > Convicted felon? $40,000 fines? Looks like an idiot in court? Convicted felon?? What was he convicted of. Dose Jerry realy know Bubba??(:-) Fred Jerry "BIG FINE" Irvine wrote: > > Cool ideas may eventually become marketable. Not sure this will unless we > > greatly expand the hobby. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Jerry I bet you wish you had 2500 people, still stupid enough to purchase your motors??? Fred > I bet you wish you had 2500 people, [attack] to purchase your > motors??? > > Fred Nope. No more motors. I sell inert goods now. In fact I only design inert goods others sell for the most part. I suggest you buy your motors from AT and CTI. And stop stalking me. Jerry SignatureJerry Irvine, Box 1242, Claremont, California 91711 USA Opinion, the whole thing. <mail to:01rocket@gte.net> Please bring common sense back to rocketry administration. Produce then publish. http://www.usrockets.com My articles valuable? Donate http://tinyurl.com/2hmgv > Nope. No more motors. I sell inert goods now. In fact I only design > inert goods others sell for the most part. You mean, inert like, "model aircraft parts", that kind of inert? Jerry "BIG FINE" Irvine wrote: > > I bet you wish you had 2500 people, [attack] to purchase your > > motors??? [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Jerry Jerry, jerry, jerry; I have never knowingly been within less than a thousand miles of your person and this is an open forum. Use your kill file or sit down and shut up..(;-) Should I info copy your lawyer?? Just think Jerry, I'll be at LDRS, (the grape vine says you won't be attending), and on vacation for the next two weeks, so you will only have Ray to keep "BIG FINE" in line..(:-) O s^*t I forgot, I have one of those new fangled lap-tops; plugs right into my cell phone.. Fred > (the grape vine says you won't be > attending), and on vacation for the next two weeks, Which grape vine? SignatureJerry Irvine, Box 1242, Claremont, California 91711 USA Opinion, the whole thing. <mail to:01rocket@gte.net> Please bring common sense back to rocketry administration. Produce then publish. http://www.usrockets.com My articles valuable? Donate http://tinyurl.com/2hmgv >>(the grape vine says you won't be >>attending), and on vacation for the next two weeks, > > Which grape vine? you know, the one with sour grapes. > > (the grape vine says you won't be > > attending), and on vacation for the next two weeks, > > Which grape vine? > > Jerry Would no longer be a grape vine, if I told you, now would it Jerry?? Don't know about you being on vacation for the next two weeks. I was talking about me being on vacation for two weeks. Didn't mean to confuse.. But don't worry Jerry, I'm not going to waste wireless airtime on RMR; don't even have News Groups loaded on the machine. Fred > Jerry "BIG FINE" Irvine wrote: > > Greatly expanding the hobby strikes fear in the hearts of NAR and TRA [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Fred Oh gosh no, Fred. Can you imagine the fine?! 2,500 X $40,000, it just wobbles the mind! steve |
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