Model Forum / General / Railroads / January 2010

True. Just recalled fixing my bike in the van between Swindon and London!
Then there was dozing off on a crate in one in a too crowded last Sunday
train from Paddington to Penzance via Swindon ...

Is that Fairford in Gloucestershire? If so, I got trapped on the USAF base
(RAF Fairford) for several hours once during a Broken Arrow alert. Some
bloke dropped a Nuke while loading a B-52. Yeah, I was one of Them. :)

Thanks for the explanations!

This was because the GWR was a "common carrier" so they couldn't refuse to
delivery any parcels etc etc consigned to them. The B set coaches that GWR
built to replace the worn out victorian non-bogie stock B set formations
mainly for branch line and minor route use were general purpose. The old B
sets would be in trouble if the guards brake vehicle in the formation
broke down which happened more and more as they got older so the
replacement vehicle were designed as general purpose - in emergency just
one coach could be used.

The size of the baggage space was determined by what had been the average
requirement in the 1920s of course by the 1950s British Road Services had
taken away a lot of the parcels traffic.

Alan

Not for LMS though. Essery - Railway operation for the Modeller states
common for 3 coach train to have brake compatrments at both ends with brake
part outermost. This was in accordance with instructions in LMS marshalling
book. Agree it seems to waste space but this isnt described from common
practice or photos but instructions issued and to alter these instructions
required authority from Divisional Superintendent of Operation !

My favourite book DJ's Historic.....notes that if there were only 2 coaches
then usually they would both be brake vehicles.

However, most amazing fact learned these few days is from Essery again,
shows pull and push train in 1938 with loco in the centre. says usually loco
at one end but not uncommon in a 4 coach train to have loco sandwhiched
between coaches !

Cheers,
Simon

SNIP...

Passenger stock was all alto braked by the later 19th century, following
some nasty accidents. From

http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/gansg/1-hist/01hist.htm

In spite of various accidents during the 1870's the railway companies had
resisted Government attempts to introduce more sophisticated brakes on
passenger trains. This was partly because of cost but also they were unable
to agree on a standard system. Following a serious accident in Ireland in
which 80 people died, many of them children, automatic continuous brakes
became mandatory on passenger stock in 1889.

Some info on UK passener stock:

http://www.igg.org.uk/gansg/00-app3-4/ap3-coach.htm

My own interest is mainly goods services, but there is a bit about vacuum
and air brake systems in

http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/gansg/4-rstock/04arstock2f.htm

Most British companies opted for the vacuum brake, and generally they
adopted the Gresham brake (patented in 1878), but several British companies
opted for the fast acting Westinghouse air-brake. An express passenger train
weighing five hundred tons and travelling at 60 miles per hour on the level
would be stopped within 360 yards by either system.

The Great Eastern, the North Eastern and the London Brighton & South Coast
Railways were still air-braked at the time of the 1923 grouping. The North
British Railway had used the Westinghouse brake but was in the process of
changing to the more popular vacuum brake by the time of the grouping. As
rolling stock travelled through the system the use of differing kinds of
brake became a problem. Some vehicles were fitted with one kind of brake and
through pipes to allow connection of differently equipped vehicles to either
side (this was called 'piped' stock). A few were equipped with both air and
vacuum brakes (called 'dual fitted'). Both these options cost money and
added complication to an already complex network so by about 1930 all
British companies had switched to the Automatic Vacuum Brake (AVB). On the
continent and in the USA the Westinghouse air brake became the norm and all
vehicles had to be 'fitted' hence wagons intended for cross-channel ferry
working between Europe and Britain were 'dual-fitted' with both air and
vacuum brakes.

In America a law had been passed in 1893 which stipulated that all railway
vehicles, be they freight or passenger, had to be equipped with automatic
air brakes. On the Continent air brake 'fitted' stock was the norm by the
time of the First World War. In Britain however the fitting of automatic
brakes was considered inappropriate to low value goods vehicles intended to
travel in slow goods trains. Some unfitted wagons had the flexible
connection hoses but were simply 'piped' as described above. These piped
wagons could be marshalled into a fully braked train, allowing the automatic
brakes on the remainder of the train to operate normally. The maximum
permitted speed of the train was then determined by the number of piped
vehicles in the rake (see also Freight Operations - Freight Train Speeds).
Only wagons fitted with a continuous automatic braking system were allowed
in trains travelling at any speed. In the context of goods traffic anything
over 40 mph was classed as 'express' up to the mid 1980's.

HTH

Mike

Perhaps in more recent times it may, but around grouping the passenger was
the priority and porters could walk 10 miles if it saved passengers a few
yards. Parcels etc would be loaded onto trolleys and porters knew exactly
where carraige would stop so they would be ready at the right point.

Cheers,
Simon